Assembly Select Committee on Select Committee on Downtown Recovery

Oh wow, that is loud. All right, perfect. Good morning, everyone. I'm going to gavel down here and welcome you all to our legislative hearing of the Select Committee on California's downtown Recovery. My name is Matt Haney.

I serve as chair of this Select Committee, and today's hearing is going to be focused specifically on San Diego's experience of recovery post pandemic economic revival and its opportunities in particular, to grow and develop through the arts, entertainment and culture.

Fittingly, we are hosting the hearing today in San Diego's Gaslamp Quarter, which is home to the city's famous and vibrant entertainment and cultural district. The Gaslamp Quarter serves as a model for driving economic development in other major cities.

Once a district literally lit by gas in the center of San Diego, the redevelopment era of the 1980s and nineties brought investment to an area dedicated to entrepreneurship, culture and nightlife. I want to give a special shout out to our venue host today, the Balboa theater. This is absolutely gorgeous.

The Balboa Theater has been here since 1924 and has served as a cultural anchor to Sandowntown, San Diego for the past century. We formed this Select Committee with a core what can we, as policymakers, do to help California's downtowns recover in the aftermath of the pandemic?

Across the state, cities are struggling to bring back the core of their workforce to downtown office buildings, leading to dramatically high levels of office vacancies and Low nine to five foot traffic.

What we've learned across the state from meeting with leaders, business leaders, local government leaders and watching what is happening over the past few years is that when cities choose to bring people cultural events and experiences downtown, they recover faster.

San Diego in many ways has stood out as a leader in resilience among California cities because it has made a conscious choice to create a downtown that centers around hospitality, tourism and people Members. We need to completely reimagine and rebrand our cities.

We know that the empty office building issue isn't going away anytime soon as many workers have hybrid schedules post pandemic and we need to consider policies that promote the development of mixed use buildings, support small businesses in downtown corridors, and welcome the residents and tourists who want to experience a city's unique history and culture.

That type of planning shouldn't be unique to San Diego. These are decisions that can happen across California. Our job today is to listen to today's panelists to understand how we can develop policies that create downtowns that people want to live near, visit and enjoy.

I believe our panelists today will be able to provide some insights to us and to how we can have strong downtowns throughout California. I want to be clear that one of the reasons why we're here is because San Diego is doing well in some ways that other cities in our state can learn from.

But we're also fully cognizant that San Diego also is experiencing many of the same challenges that other cities across the state are, homelessness, mental illness, public safety challenges, vacant office buildings as well.

And so our job is to learn from what is happening here and the opportunities that you all are pursuing, but also how we as state policymakers can support your recovery and confront the challenges that you're facing. We have three panels today. Witnesses of each panel will come up together and provide their testimony by order of introduction.

After each witness has testified, the Members of the Committee may ask that panel questions or take the opportunity to make any remarks. At the end of the hearing, there will be opportunity for public comment and individuals in the hearing room.

A public comment will be limited to 30 seconds per person, and we are not accepting public comment over the phone today. But you can submit written testimony to the Committee at assemblymember haneysembly Ca.Gov. The email is also on our website.

Before I introduce the first panel, I want to give my colleagues an opportunity to make any opening remarks as well. I also very much want to thank the San Diego delegation for allowing us to be here, for hosting us, and for their partnership in confronting the big challenges that we're facing.

You have an extraordinary set of legislators representing San Diego, and they have been steadfast in their determination to support San Diego's downtown and the various policies that we need to make in order to recover fully statewide. So as a San Franciscan, I'm grateful to be here.

I represent downtown San Francisco and to be able to partner with you all on all of these issues is something that I think is going to bear fruit for both of our cities.

So with that, I will open it up to my colleagues if you want to make any introductory remarks as well, and then we will get started.

Yeah. Mister Harpers.

Thank you, Mister Haney. And good morning to everybody. It's great to be in this building again.

It's actually, I was just here a couple weeks ago for a performance, but it's always wonderful to be at the Balboa Theater and among you all who care so much about what is happening in San Diego and certainly downtown, I am assembling Member David Alvarez.

I represent just literally a stone's throw away from downtown, heading south all the way to the border with Mexico, representing the cities of Chula Vista, National City, San Diego and Imperial beach. And really an honor to be here today to talk about this.

Some of you who have followed me prior on the City Council might remember some of the statements I've made in the past about our downtown. Sometimes I think they've been misconstrued, but I think it's a good opportunity to talk about why downtowns matter to people who represent areas outside of downtown, because they do matter.

The division of neighborhoods or of districts or any of that is just on paper. What our community does is they integrate into our region. And downtowns are an important part of the integration of a community and of society. And if San Diego is to be successful, it must have a successful downtown just like every other city.

But that also means how do we think about and how do we intentionally create those links with our communities that are adjacent to downtown and whether it's to the north or to the west or in my case to the south, that all really, really matters.

And so I think when I think about what work remains to be done and that hopefully those of us at the state could help support. You know, in the last two legislative sessions, I've been raising the issue of redevelopment.

I was on the City Council when we had it the highest number of affordable housing units built because of it, not just in downtown, but in the areas that were project areas just outside downtown, like Barrio Logan. And we've seen those dollars dried up. We saw what happened after 2012.

And the mayor, Gloria and I were both on the City Council and how we lost the opportunity to use the only real successful tool we had to do that. And yet in spite of that, you know, we've seen some progress made here in downtown San Diego. But I still think that's a tool that we need to revisit.

We currently, without really trying to in any way try to cast any blame on this, but we don't have sort of statewide consensus or much less leadership on this issue.

And I hope that part of these conversations can lead us to that and a new version of redevelopment that allows us to make sure we invest in our downtowns, but that we also use that tool and the success of that it creates in downtown to help support and grow and create opportunities outside of downtown.

So I'm looking forward to today's conversation. I am really looking forward to getting ideas. I think that's what these Select Committees are about. You are the practitioners, you are on the ground. Certainly our mayor is working hard on many issues.

And so I think from my perspective, what we can sometimes do best is just how do we get out of the way state government and in the rules and the policies that we have in place that get in the way of the innovation and the work that needs to happen locally. So I'm looking forward to the conversation.

Thank you Mister chair.

Thank you Mister chair. And I'll start by just saying that I want to ditto some of the sentiments on redevelopment. My name is Ash Khalra. I represent San Jose, including downtown San Jose.

And I think we saw some of the same things that occurred in downtown San Jose and throughout San Jose in terms of housing production when we had those redevelopment resources.

But to talk more broadly about downtowns, I think I was at a ribbon cutting yesterday in downtown San Jose where we just actually today, 700 students going to be moving into, from San Diego State University into downtown San Jose into a tower that was part of the Fairmont Hotel and San Luc State University bought it from them in order to house students in a very creative kind of way that really hasn't been seen before.

And those are the kinds of things that I'm excited to learn about in exchanging ideas.

I think as Assemblymember Haney alluded to, when we look at the recovery, I think that there's a General consensus that San Diego has done a good job and has done well coming out of the pandemic, even with some of the challenges that all big cities are facing.

And so part of what I'm interested in learning about listening from the mayor, business leaders, arts and cultural leaders, is in this new world where you're not going to have necessarily as many people in the office, how do you attract people in the downtown, not just from out of town, but from the metropolitan area, give them reasons to come into downtown with arts, with culture, with entertainment, with other avenues for families to enjoy themselves in the downtown.

And so I think that San Diego can definitely share with many of us throughout the state examples of how you do it right.

And I'm hopeful that these collective conversations that we'll be having around the state will allow all of us to kind of have this interconnectedness with our downtowns so that we can continue to see them thrive. Thank you.

Good morning. Thank you, chair. My name is Doctor Akilah Weber. I am the Assembly Member that represents the 79th Assembly District, which covers portions of southeast San Diego and the cities of Lemon Grove, La Mesa, parts of El Cajon, and the unincorporated area of Spring Valley. So just the eastern portion of San Diego. county.

And first I want to thank Chair Haney for coming to San Diego and having this hearing here. I'm always delighted when we can have conversations from the state here and highlight some of the things that we are doing down here in San Diego. Sometimes people forget that there's a city south of Los Angeles.

So thank you so much for coming. You know, definitely want to echo what my colleagues have already stated, so I won't reiterate those, but, you know, having a strong downtown, one that recruits individuals to the entire area is extremely important. So just because I don't necessarily represent this area right now, the people that I represent work here.

They come here for plays. They come here to relax. They come here to eat. And it's extremely important that you have a very strong downtown to have a very strong region.

And so I'm very much looking forward to this conversation to hear about all of the wonderful things that we have done, but also some of the challenges that we continue to face and how we as a state can sometimes get out of the way, but also work as a partner to improve those things.

Because once we improve those things, we not only improve it for downtown San Diego, but we improve it for the entire San Diego region, which is extremely important to all of us that represent any part of this region. So once again, thank you, Assemblymember Haney, for having us here.

And I am very much looking forward to this conversation today.

Thank you. Thank you. And again, thank you so much to my colleagues. Some of them recall we're coming down from San Jose and to be hosted here by Assembly Members Alvarez and Weber. It's a great honor.

We are here because we love San Diego and what is happening here is impressive in many ways as we tour the state and different, and we want to learn from it, but also because there's a vision and a lot of opportunities here that we want to make sure the state is supportive of.

And I will also say, and we could settle this debate right now, San Diego does have the best tacos of anywhere in the state. There's no question about that. And so we are fans of San Diego and excited to be here.

With that, I want to welcome up our first panel, which is focusing on the San Diego strategy for a thriving post Covid downtown. We are so grateful to be able to have Mayor Todd Gloria here with us. We are grateful for your time and also for your leadership.

We know that many of the things that are happening here are because of your own commitment and vision for this city. And you have, I think, some of your former colleagues up here.

So having that local and state experience is so important to help us understand how we can be helpful and supportive of the work that you're doing. And Betsy Brennan, who's the CEO and President of downtown San Diego Partnership. Just an extraordinary vision. And we've been able to connect on many occasions and spending time with them this morning.

We know that you are instrumental to everything that is happening in this city and downtown. And we want to thank you also for helping us with this hearing. Really did this in partnership with the downtown San Diego partnership. So thank you all. Thank you both for being here. And I'll turn it over to you, Mister Mayor.

Thank you Mister Chairman. And thank you for this opportunity. Thank you to your colleagues, two of our great local Assembly Members and Ash Kalra. Great to see everyone here. Let me just say that you have incredible taste choosing the Balboa Theater. Some of you may know, or I should share with you, this is the 100th anniversary of this theater.

Getting back to some Member Alvarez's comments, it would not still be here. It wasn't for redevelopment. And forgive me if I have a few flashbacks while sitting here. This is where I do our State of the city address. So it's a little odd to be here and not have the full responsibility.

So I'm grateful Betsy's here to do this as a tag team. And I really appreciate the chance to talk about our downtown, of which I'm extremely proud of, and maybe take the opportunity to hit a couple of key issues I'd like panel to know about.

As you consider policymaking in Sacramento, maybe off the top, let me just say thank you for your collective leadership on a number of things that have helped make this possible. A lot of the things here would not be happening without the benefit of direct state investment, state policy making, et cetera.

And so I think that's why you're here, to find out what's working and perhaps what more you can do. And I'm absolutely happy to share. For some level setting, I think the benefit of our downtown and the success of it has been that we have a balance here.

You know, I recognize for a lot of downtowns, it's the place you go to work during the day and then you leave it at night. Some of the key cultural and other venues are not necessarily in downtown.

What we have chosen to do over many decades is to concentrate, really a balance of housing, jobs, cultural amenities, and hotel retail nightlife in our downtown, creating a more of a 24/7 city in this location.

That seemed fine before the pandemic, but I think in the aftermath of it, understanding why this downtown rebounded faster than others, more completely than others, is to do with the fact that it wasn't that people all vacated downtown during the pandemic. Thousands of people, myself included, live in downtown. This is our community.

And that is a good base from which to start. As folks returned to work, as venues reopened, and as we got back to some level of normalcy, I will say that it also helped that we opened a world class venue like the Shell, the Rady Shell in downtown.

For those of you that have not seen it, please go do yourself a favor, a little mayoral direction. Get over there and see it. My staff has told me to call it the Hollywood bowl of San Diego. We don't define ourselves as LA around here. So I'll simply say it's like the Sydney Opera House of San Diego.

Outdoor venue, incredible events that are there, that opened almost immediately after the reopening of the economy. It has been a home run and in many ways I think it's like a gift to our community after the disaster of Covid-19 to really welcome people back, funnily enough, in an outdoor setting right on our waterfront.

And I think I share that, not just because it's not extraordinary, it certainly is extraordinary. But I think it's emblematic of what we try to do in downtown. High quality design, incredible place making, wonderful programming, world class space. It has invited people back down to downtown. It has helped with the resurgence.

So I want to hit four key issues, and then you'll hear from our incredible President and CEO of the downtown San Diego Partnership. But I'm going to tell you something you already know, which is that housing is key to everything.

And I want to let you know that thanks to a lot of leadership at the state level, not the least of which is things like your pro housing city designation, of which San Diego was the first big city in the state to get that designation.

We have tried to concentrate, well build housing, really in every community, but in downtown, it has been a driver for change. Fun facts for you to know. Between 2022 and 2023, the City of San Diego doubled the total number of homes permanent in our city from about 5000 to just below 10,000.

Those are permanent, so those are under construction or will be very, very soon. We've tripled the number of accessory dwelling units in our city, also known as Granny Flats. Again, a lot of state leadership on the production of adus. We try to take what the state has done and raise the ante to do even more.

We're now held up as a national example of how to do that. Good news on those naturally affordable housing. No public subsidy, just allowing the permitting to happen. That's creating a lot of working and middle class housing that otherwise would not exist in our city.

We've quadrupled the number of income restricted affordable homes permitted in the city, and we've permitted eight times the number of transit orient developments under our complete communities program.

Funnily enough, authorized under a Bill that some of you voted for when I was in the Legislature and is paying dividends and hopefully can be replicated in other parts of, of California. I'd like to say that the official bird of San Diego is the crane, and that is true in downtown, but it's also true in uptown.

In the University City area, where we have a lot of construction happening right now, there are 6000 homes under construction or in the permitting process in downtown, which would increase the area's housing stock by almost 18%. That's pretty incredible.

This is in addition to the 2 million office space, over 600,000 retail space, and more than 3300 hotel rooms that are either under construction or in the permitting process in downtown right now. That level of investment is pretty remarkable given the capital markets, interest rates, et cetera. San Diego really is an outlier with regard to investment.

And again, I think it's a lot to do with generations worth of efforts that are here, as well as a lot of folks who are currently doing things to make this an attractive place to invest. So housing is key to all of this.

And I hope that for jurisdictions that are housing hesitant, they get over it, get on with it, and not only do you need to have people have housing that they can afford, but it will actually add to the economic vibrancy of your city.

Not surprisingly, homelessness would be the second issue I want to raise with you all today. We, of course, because of the high housing costs, drives homelessness, and that is the top challenge in San Diego. It's in California. And I would argue across our country. I'm active in the us conference of Mayors.

There's no meeting that we have that doesn't center around the issue of homelessness. I don't care if it's a red state, blue state, coastal inland, we're all dealing with it, and certainly no exception here.

But thanks to the resources you've provided us through the Hap and home key and other programs, we have been able to dramatically increase the amount of sheltering offerings that we have in our city and combine it with enforcement that has resulted in a significant reduction in encampments in downtown San Diego last year.

About a year ago, we passed an unsafe camping ordinance that reset expectations. After the pandemic, probably, like your cities, ours followed CDC guidance. We didn't clear encampments during the pandemic in hopes of trying to help reduce the public health risk.

Once that was removed, we lost sight, I think, of what our expectations were of really everybody housed and unhoused in our downtown as well as across the city. Our unsafe camping ordinance helped to reset those expectations. It is not okay to encamp near schools, near parks.

We cannot force children, the disabled, and others to walk in the street just to get by in a neighborhood like downtown. City Council adopted that, and I will take this opportunity to share with the Committee that when we talk about enforcement, the City of San Diego is not an enforcement only effort.

At the same time that we passed our unsafe camping ordinance, we also launched, with the help of the downtown San Diego partnership, our city's first safe sleeping sites to sanctioned encampment locations. To tell people that you may not be here at this school, but you can go over here and get connected to services.

It's a far superior experience to be able to have access to hygiene, to food, to services, and has been extremely successful. 86% of the folks in our safe sleeping sites have never previously interacted with our shelter system.

This is getting people who are normally known as service resistant, or perhaps choose homelessness to instead have an option that's attractive to them, get them to connect to care, and on a path to ending their homelessness for good.

So with your help, we have been able to more than increase by 70% the number of shelter offerings in our city. I think that has helped with our recovery. Let me state very clearly, we are not where I want us to be. This is not mission accomplished. But I think our trend lines are encouraging.

And with some additional help, I think we can do more to make sure that downtown and every neighbor in the city is attractive for those who want to come live, work, and play in them that gets to public safety. I will say that obviously, first responsibility of government is to keep us all safe.

This is an interesting and challenging time to do that, I think for the reasons of substance use disorders, specifically deadly drugs like fentanyl and tranq. Some Member Alvarez and I have long worked in downtown San Diego. We've long had encampments in other associated quality of life issues.

But the presence of these deadly drugs have been a game changer, not just in the fatality which is evident, but in the encampments that were always sort of been there, but are now much more pronounced and the kinds of activities that are in those encampments. I would trace back to this.

Over the past three years, nearly 2400 people in our county have died from fentanyl overdose, and a lot of that occurs in our downtown area.

We have to do more to address this particular issue from all manners of the spectrum, from services, detox, rehab opportunities, as well as holding dealers accountable for when they provide these deadly drugs to people. So public safety continues to be an issue.

Appreciate the leadership on some of the retail theft legislation that I believe the Governor may be signing today. I think that will go a long way to helping to improve the safety, not just in downtown, but elsewhere. Those are three issues. Last one, infrastructure. Reminder.

When they say infrastructure is not sexy, that is simply an excuse not to Fund it. And I personally think it's pretty darn important to vibrant downtown.

We have prioritized repairing our roads and particularly making them more hospitable to users of all abilities and manners so that you can get to downtown by walking, biking, riding safely, taking transit or driving. We have made more road investments thanks to things like Senate Bill one in our community.

We did 321 miles of roads last year, which is a high point in recent history. We're taking the opportunity to also reimagine our streets. Some of you may have checked out the Fifth Avenue promenade through our Gaslamp quarter. That was done at the request of businesses who are trying to navigate.

The pandemic is now a permanent feature of our downtown, and that's the current Low cost, easy to implement version. We're looking forward to a grander vision that will be much more akin to some of the more famous promenades around the world soon enough.

So that, coupled with Petco park, the convention center, our Bayfront Balboa park list goes on and on.

We have an embarrassment of riches in San Diego, and with your help, we'll continue to keep it that way and hope that what we pioneer here, from our pro housing policies that should be replicated in other cities, to our homelessness strategies which should be replicated in other cities, our public safety initiatives and our infrastructure investment, I think represents a blueprint for how we can have vibrant downtowns all across California.

And the City of San Diego is always willing to partner with the Legislature and our partners in Sacramento to help be able to do more of that. So thank you for the opportunity to share some of those thoughts, Mister Chairman, I'll turn it back to you.

Thank you so much, Mister Mayor, and appreciate you laying out that vision. I'm sure there was some of that that was in your State of the city speech. It's very compelling and we appreciate your partnership and some of the areas that we can continue to work on to be able to support you.

I'm going to turn it over now to Betsy, and then we'll have a bit of a dialogue after your presentation.

Well, thank you so much, chair Haney and Members of the Committee. And thank you, Mayor Gloria. The city has been an amazing partner with Mayor Gloria leading those efforts. I'm Betsy Brennan, and I've had the pleasure of serving as the President and CEO of the downtown San Diego Partnership for the past six years.

For those that don't know, the downtown San Diego Partnership is a nonprofit organization that serves as the principal voice and driving force behind the economic prosperity and cultural vitality of downtown San Diego. We also serve as the managing organization for the property improvement, the property and business improvement district, otherwise known as clean and safe.

For more than 20 years, this clean and safe program has provided enhanced services like pressure washing, landscaping, trash pickup, security, beautification and unhoused care to our ratepayers in the 275 blocks of downtown San Diego.

And throughout that time, we worked very, very closely with the City of San Diego because we are doing the enhanced services while they continue to do the wonderful baseline services. We also are an advocacy organization and are proud Members of the California Downtown Association. And we support policies that align with our strategic goals for downtown.

And that organization has been wonderful to sort of unite policies across the state so we can talk to our Legislature in a more unified way. We also are adept at the navigating public policy discussions at the city and the county where we need to change policies to benefit the public realm.

Things like bike lanes, mobility, pandemic, evolution of street dining, among many other things. And it is our hope that this work helps create a vibrant and dynamic downtown that inspires innovation, creativity, and a sense of belonging. We want a sense of belonging for all San Diegans.

This is your downtown and we are building that vision with you and for you. And this is a place that deepens our sense of community and inspires an exchange of ideas. And again, I just want to take a moment to thank our Legislature and our Council Member, Whitburn.

He is our downtown Council Member and also the entire City Council and mayor, because they have been with us as we've tried these innovative things. You're not sure if every single thing is going to happen, is going to be successful, but they've allowed us that flexibility to be creative and to try things in downtown San Diego.

And that's probably one of the reasons you see our recovery going faster, because we have to try different things after the pandemic and we have to get creative throughout the city.

I began my position at the downtown San Diego partnership in 2018 and little did I know that two years later this relationship and our world might be changed and sort of turned upside down.

And in true amazing resiliency fashion of all of our downtowns in the US, it has been really amazing for me to see my team and my colleagues and people from all across different paths come together to work on downtown San Diego.

And I think that does have to do with the fact that we really believe San Diego, this downtown is for San Diegan. So people from North County, South County, East County, this is for you and you are welcome here. And so what do we need to do to drive policies, to drive projects that make San Diegans welcome?

Because if we build a downtown for San Diegans, tourism will come. We need to be authentic and we need to do this for our residents and for our people.

And we also have 115 employees at the downtown San Diego partnership and they come from all over the region, mainly from the city, but mainly from the southe part of our City of San Diego. And so we very much listen to our employees. How is it for transit? How is it for their daily commute?

How do they feel about bringing their families to downtown? We heard that from the Assembly Member earlier today. So those are all really important things. You need to listen to the people that work for you and that are down here working every day.

In downtown San Diego, trends like hybrid and remote work and the reassessment of exclusive office space became standard and paved the way for what used to traditionally be called central business districts. And we've really moved on from that and we are central connectivity districts.

Richard, Florida talks a lot about that, the University of Toronto, but really we are a central connectivity district. What do you want to do in downtown? Why do you come here? You might not have to come here for work, but do we have a way to connect you to other people in an authentic way?

So that's maybe not as flashy, not always in the headlines, but I do want to remind my colleagues and anybody watching this that cities have changed over time. This is a natural maturation of a city.

So from the 19th century when people lived above their shopkeeper spaces, which is now coming back in vogue, you know what's old is new again, and then the twenties to the fifties, when downtown served as the commercial and cultural institution, institutions of a place.

And then we get into the sixties and seventies where people were moving out to the suburbs and the prevalence of the automobile, and we had some malls and other things being built in downtown. So downtown had to reinvent itself then and it has to reinvent itself now.

So what we know from studying all these flexibility and change is that everything, everything is flexible. And a downtown is as resilient and as strong as the people that care about it and that make these policies for a downtown. And every major city in the entire world has a thriving downtown.

Without a thriving downtown, it's very difficult to have a thriving city in General. So we really are doubling down on things like transportation, arts, nightlife, parks, and the things that make a downtown special. We also are really seeing this happen right here in our downtown and building that downtown for San Diegans that we talked about.

Of the 26 largest downtowns in the country that lost residents, nearly all of them have now more people living in downtown than they did in 2020. So that's going to be a really important theme that you will see.

You heard it from the mayor and you'll hear it probably throughout today that the residential experience in building more housing leads to more jobs and more retail. So the housing brings those things to where you build it. And downtown has been very supportive of density and building, but in a smart way.

We want the facilities, we want the parks, we want the amenities that people also want to see.

So, yeah, since 2019, we've had 3600 new homes, new units built in downtown San Diego, and we have another 3500 units in the pipeline already financed and ready for construction in downtown, of which more than 600 of those are affordable units. It's really important to know that downtown welcomes affordable development.

We have the most affordable development in all of the City of San Diego, and we want to continue on that track. We really believe in mixed income communities, from workforce to affordable to permanent, supportive to luxury and everything in between. So we definitely want to be a hub for.

We have seven unique neighborhoods, too, in downtown, and that was already established. It's been established sort of since San Diego came to be in downtown. And it's a largely driven by industries like military, startup culture, the traditional office, but also hospitality.

So hospitality is very big in San Diego, and that's been helpful when we want to talk about recovery. And what are we excited about in this next chapter for San Diego? Well, there's so much to be excited about.

But a lot of what is happening in Sacramento and at the Legislature is helping us allow those things to happen in San Diego. So we are talking about doing an arts and culture district in downtown with the support of the mayor and the City Council. We have those natural things here.

You're in one of the beautiful spaces right here. But we've never really marketed downtown as that arts and culture district and that is a big reason why people come into downtown. So we need to celebrate that and better market those assets.

We're also doing major catalytic work with the help of a local foundation, the Conrad Prebis foundation, in partnership with the City of San Diego, to reimagine what the civic center could look like. Because for a long time there was not a lot of housing in our city center.

Like many of you with traditional CBD's and because of the leadership of Mayor Gloria and the City Council, we now allow for mixed use in those spaces. And you are seeing new residential come into areas that hadn't seen it before.

It may take a few years until you really say, zero wow, this area is a neighborhood where you can live and work and play.

We also are reassessing all of the public realm in places like C Street along our transit corridors, working very closely with the city again and with MTS, our regional transit authority, to say how can we better, better allow for facilities and amenities when people are taking the trolley and the local bus services?

I mean, I know personally I have a 14 and a 16 year old and with the wonderful free passes that they were allowed to have this summer, they've been taking transit all over the place. I mean, almost uncomfortably so. I'm getting more and more used to it.

But they'll tell me I'm at this skate park or I'm downtown and I'm at Petco park and I'm here. zero, could you check in more often because you're still only 14 and 16. But it's been a real game changer for our teenagers to start to love downtown and be in downtown.

But we have to make sure we have amenities for our teenagers so that they're doing positive things when they are downtown and then it just becomes their downtown. And so when they get in their twenties, forties, sixties, it's still their downtown. So this a good example of that is the Bay De Parc Paseo.

That is a nonprofit entity that came together led by Pete Garcia and Beth Callender.

But they worked with 14 different world renowned architecture firms and took a public street because the city let us do this on Park Boulevard and did art installations all the way from Balboa park to the water to better connect the bay and the park, because that's also maybe been a criticism of downtown.

We don't always know how to connect the park to the waterfront and everything in between. So we're not stopping there.

And we are so excited to be part of this conversation and to understand what else we can do in the public realm to really activate a downtown and a place where people of all ages can live and work and flourish and enjoy our so here's one.

You'll see other cities, I won't name them, but maybe they're on the East Coast and maybe they have a national capital in them. Talk about the outdoor patio season. Well, we have that outdoor patio season all year long in most of California.

So how do we get policies at the state level to really activate that outdoor patio season 365 days a year? So I am honored to be here. I am honored to be serving in this role in America's finest city. And we strive to be America's best outdoor downtown.

And I know you all have wonderful downtowns, too, and we'll share that. We'll share that with your downtowns as well. Thank you very much for letting me be here today.

Thank you so much, President Brennan and Mayor Gloria, for your comments and your work and your vision. I'm going to start it off with a couple questions and then I'll open it up to my colleagues. I'm going to ask them both together and then feel free to take them as you like.

The first thing I wanted to raise is one of the things that we're seeing all across our state is, of course, the office vacancies. And that's true in every city in California. Unfortunately, many of our cities are experiencing that even greater than others across the country.

I wonder both how you all are approaching that in terms of thinking about either trying to bring folks into downtown to fill those up, or also whether you're seeing any interest or trends towards adaptive reuse. One of the areas that we've been focusing on at the state level is how to make it easier for change of use.

As Assemblymember Alvarez said, getting out of the way in some cases, and you have beautiful older buildings here, are you able to put them in a position to be able to make sure they're being used in some way, whether that's in housing or other types of uses?

And if the housing that you're seeing is all new housing or some of it is happening through adaptive reuse the other thing that I wanted to maybe have you talk a little bit more, you raised it at the end there.

President Brennan, the move towards San Diego as an outdoor city, and you shared with me that you want to be the number one outdoor city in the country and have a whole vision towards that. Also, another thing that I think that we need to embrace is 24 hours city.

So, you know, I was able to, last time I was here, go to a 24 hours restaurant that was open all night. That type of movement towards thinking about our downtowns is not just a nine to five place, but actually a 24 hours connectivity location for your outdoor vision and for your sort of 24 hours vision.

What are some of the policy changes that you're looking at around that? And are there things that you think the state could be doing to support that work?

Yeah, sure.

I think I'd try and tackle the first part and then I think the rest is perhaps for Betsy, from an office conversion standpoint, our city has updated our land of development codes and whatnot to allow that to be.

I would be surprised at this point if someone who wanted to propose that would not be able to legally accomplish that in the city under our policies. I think the bigger challenge is making that a financial reality.

We are certainly getting folks who are exploring that, proposing it, but it's from a, this is the cost associated with it, and the cost is fairly substantial. I think older buildings tend to be easier targets for this kind of conversion.

And I think you'll see, have seen and we'll see more in our downtown and frankly, across our city. But it's the 1960s, 1970s, eighties office buildings that are, the conversion is extremely difficult, even with our permissive codes. So how do you get the windows to open? How do you adjust the ceiling heights, etcetera? Again, we're all in.

And if someone, correct me if I'm wrong, if you've had something that you think is great, I think our codes are now permissive. For the challenge is that the building conversion cost is so substantial that it makes it limiting. But also demolition of that same building is also extremely difficult.

And so the financial code for that has not been cracked yet. And I noticed other mayors have been asked for subsidies. I don't think we're in a financial position really to do that just yet.

We've tried to do it through the code to try and eliminate, as some of has mentioned, some of the ways that we throw up our own barriers. But even then, the cost of entry to that is tens of millions, if not more. And that becomes why.

I don't think we've seen the substantial number that you'd want to have happen, but I'm absolutely open to it, and I'm hopeful this Committee can, might yield some suggestions how localities like mine can do it. Betsy probably has some thoughts on that as well as the outdoor stuff.

Hello. I would say that it is very unique and special that the City of San Diego updates their land development code annually.

That allows for a lot of flexibility, because something might just not even be on the horizon 12 months ago, but with that flexibility, and the staff at their development services Department and their economic Development Department are wonderful to work with. They have a carved out urban division for our downtown neighborhoods, which is very helpful for development.

To always be working with the same team and understand exactly what the codes are and how to best leverage things. That's been very helpful. And at the state level, the conversion legislation is important. And again, like the mayor said, a lot of those buildings that are best suited for that are 1920s to 1950s.

We don't have as many of those in downtown, but we do in the City of San Diego. And so that's gonna be very important legislation. And in downtown, we absolutely have seen some of that. A lot of conversion to hotel seems to be a little bit easier for regulation reasons, fire codes, those kind of things.

But we are celebrating each and every one of those. There's maybe three to five in the pipeline right now for conversion, and we're hoping to see some of those come to fruition. As far as hospitality and entertainment zones, I think that's very interesting.

The legislation that came out of Sacramento and maybe this newest Bill that's going to enhance some of those policies, that's going to be really important for things like the mayor talked about with our Fifth Avenue promenade.

In some of the projects we've invested, the City of San Diego's invested, or the communities have invested in, in our seven distinct neighborhoods in downtown, because each one really deserves a town center and an area of focus.

And we have that some of our neighboring communities are here, like North park with their mini park and things like that. You need that sort of central area, and it goes back again. I mean, these were how cities were built right around a central, central plaza for hundreds of years.

So to have that central plaza and to have an entertainment zone allowed and, you know, within reason, and you can have all sorts of policies set up, that's really important because people do have all different times of day and night where they're working or they're wanting to go out go for a stroll.

We want it to be clear, clean, and safe and vibrant. If you go to Barcelona, I'm sure tonight there will be people walking from 02:00 a.m. to 05:00 a.m. just because that's when they want to go out and walk.

We want that same experience in our cities in California that they have in Europe, and we've got that merging. But you all have made it even easier. I'd love to see us take advantage of those entertainment zones.

And there's also some things with special event permitting, both at the city level, but also at the state level, that we could probably enhance just to make it more blanket. Special event permit. If you sort of check all these boxes, yes, you can get a special event permit for the entire downtown.

And that would allow a lot of neighborhood groups and nonprofit groups to get through the permitting a little bit easier.

Assembly Member Kalra.

Thank you. Thank you both so much. Ms. Brennan, you're right where you're supposed to be because your energy and your vision is so infectious. I really loved to hear you talk about the downtown in such a passionate manner. And I'm glad to hear that some of the things the state's doing is helping those efforts.

I think sometimes you pass legislation, and it's usually only a handful of cities that really dive in and take advantage of some of the things that we're trying to do. And I'm really happy to hear that San Diego is one of them. And I think that's evidenced by the resurgence.

And so one thing I just, like an ask, is we have a similar select committee that our colleague, Assembly Member Buffy Wicks, has put forward on permitting. Just generally speaking, it could be, it's more general. Could be on housing. It could be on other issues. And so I would just encourage you to let us know on that particular front so that we can bring those issues up when we have those committee hearings on permitting issues. Obviously, we can take that into account and take that in now as well.

But since that's focusing on that, I think it will be great to be able to hear what things that we've done that have helped on the permitting front, what things that we still need to do, and what obstacles you're still facing, particularly in creating these entertainment zones and creating these art and culture spaces, helping to facilitate outdoor dining.

And as you said, like bring, have places where families can go, where youth can go and feel comfortable and safe and actually, you know, want to go to. As you said, you're 100% right, talking about your children who are teenagers. You want them to grow up thinking this is their downtown because they're the ones that are going to be here in their twenties, thirties, forties, hopefully the rest of their life, enjoying it, investing in it, living in it. And so it's just wonderful to hear everything that's been going on. I definitely was walking around this morning.

It's absolutely noticeable, the housing that's been built compared to 10, 12 years ago. And it's clearly been very intentional. And I'm happy to hear that that's a continued effort under the leadership of Mayor Gloria and the partnership of the business leaders. One question is regarding the investment from the business community. I imagine there are TOT or other types of taxes. Do you have any kind of PBID or any kind of self taxation that the businesses are doing to help enhance the downtown?

Thank you for that question. And I would say, first on the permitting, thank you very much for that committee I am a land use attorney by background, and I'd like to put myself out of business...

We'll have to have you speak at that one to then.

My colleagues that are lobbyists, I love them, but we shouldn't have to have a land use attorney or a lobbyist to have a nonprofit community organization get a permit to do a ballet in the street, those kind of things. And our city has been great with place making, but there's still a lot of room and opportunity there. So thank you for that question. Yeah, I'm happy to put myself out of business on the land use attorney side. And on the policies and what we do here at the City of San Diego.

Yes, so the Downtown San Diego Partnership's been around since the 1950s, but for the last 25 years, we've run the Property Business Improvement District in the 285 blocks of downtown San Diego. So the city provides all baseline services so that we still have wonderful city employees, and all those city jobs exist. We do everything enhanced above that.

And our property owners are asked every 10 years, would you like to keep investing in this program? We are in that right now. And yes, we are at City Council, September on this very issue for another 10 year term. And our businesses are just, our properties, and our businesses, our properties in our businesses are overwhelmingly supportive of this program.

They see the impact and the positive impact of this. And this time around, something new that we've never done in our 25 years history of running the PBID, the Clean and Safe Program is we're going to be doing enhanced maintenance, safety, and activation in our parks of downtown.

And that did require a conversation and an additional investment from our property owners. So we are very pleased that they agreed to go ahead and invest in that because our Park and Rec departments are wonderful, but they don't have all the resources that they need. So this is just enhanced.

And we want everyone that comes to downtown to enjoy that. So our property owners are investing in that because they want to see more and more San Diegans and more and more tourists come to San Diego and enjoy it. So it's a virtuous cycle and also allows the city to have distribution of their very, very important resources throughout the city. And we can do the enhanced service up and above. We also have some BIDs, some Business Improvement Districts here in downtown. Some that we manage and run, and some that we don't.

And we need to work very closely because those are within the PBID boundaries. So my colleagues, many of them are here, we try very hard to figure out who's doing the marketing on that or who's doing this big project so we can maximize and leverage those resources. I know that there's people here from San Francisco and from all over the state and they have similar programs there. But I'm very, very grateful for our team members. More than 100 of them are working 24/7, 365 days a year.

I have members of my team that have been on our team for more than 20 years, and they are just wonderful employees. We know their families. We know where... I mean, this is their career, and they come from all over the city and some from Tijuana. Actually, about three of our team members are living in Tijuana and come across every day. So we want to make sure we have policies that support all of those people.

Well, good luck on the PBID vote process. Sounds like at the end of the day, it's about return on investment. It sounds like because the work of the partnership and the city and everyone else involved that having good results from it. And so I'm glad to hear that there's a consideration of expanding some of that work into the parks and what have you to achieve some of the goals that you've laid forth. And, Mayor, I had one, I know you had my city mayor here recently to talk about some of the, you mentioned the second topic that we all are contending with, with our unhoused population. And I've personally been a fan of sanctioned encampments for a long time, as opposed to sweeping and the resources that takes and the instability and in some cases the cruelty of it.

I think that if there's an opportunity to create those encampments. In San Jose, as you may know, we've focused a lot on tiny homes, but tiny home communities do not have a tiny cost. They're very expensive. In the meantime, what do you do with those that are camping or living by the creeks or in the parks? So in creating that kind of community, is that a partnership with the county and nonprofits and what have you? Like, how have you set that up? Which is something I'm sure you shared with our mayor, and I would love to be able to hear that as well.

I appreciate that. And as you mentioned, Mayor of San Jose was here earlier this week, but we've also welcomed the mayors of Phoenix and Fort Lauderdale and Sacramento. I mean, people have come to see this, and so I think you're going to see more of it.

What I would tell you is that the two that we have basically add up to 500 tents across two different locations. Both of those properties are city owned properties. So with regard to the ability to execute this quickly, we were able to stand up the first safe sleeping site in about a month's time.

The second one came on about two months later. I mean, it's a very quick operation. The costs are minimal compared to tiny homes or other interventions. And as I mentioned earlier, they're wildly popular. And I want to confess, I had a lot of reticence about this intervention.

I have a bias towards believing that we're, as a society, should live indoors and... But in the midst of this crisis, it seemed unreasonable to turn down any intervention. We should try. Betsy was talking before. We should try and see if it works. In this case, Council Member Stephen Whitburn championed this.

I said, okay, let's give it a shot. And it's worked. They are full, they are well utilized. They are being accessed by people who previously have declined assistance. And to your question, while we don't have county participation at either of those safe sleeping sites, we do have help from the nonprofit sector.

Our two sites are run by the Downtown San Diego Partnership and another nonprofit organization, Dreams for Change. You may have met their CEO. She's been honored by both Senator Atkins and, I believe, Assembly Member Ward up in Sacramento. Bottom line is they, you know, we're not just inviting people to come hang out at these two sites.

We have case management, housing navigation, healthcare assistance, the list goes on and on. It is an entry point into ending people's homelessness. It gets them to envision a better life for themselves. When I was at the site on Monday with Mayor Mahan, Teresa, who is the CEO of Dreams for Change, shared with...

There's something that happens when the person in the tent next to you gets housing and how it informs to the person next door that that's possible. Maybe they couldn't see it for themselves, maybe they didn't believe it, but it's that sort of, you know, if you can see it, you can be, it is happening in those sites.

And again, this was a very difficult population. These are folks who are very much disconnected from care, very much the people that we probably get the most calls for service about. And so I appreciate you asking about that. I think the benefits are these are they're very popular, they're easy to deploy, they're relatively less expensive, and they should be a part of an overall response system. Last thing, if I may just be so greedy with your time.

You mentioned the permitting issue, and this may be more appropriate for Assembly Member or Chairwoman Wicks, but I would just take this opportunity. Because permitting is very much a part about whether or not we have vibrant communities and vibrant downtowns.

A year, 18 months ago, I issued an executive order directing staff to permit 100% affordable housing projects in 30 days or less. You might imagine that was not necessarily welcomed with open arms. Initially, there was real concern by staff whether or not they could hit that mark.

I'm here to tell you that 18 months later, not only did they meet that mark, but they exceed it. We're often processing 100% affordable projects in seven to nine days. So what used to take months or years is now being done in weeks or days. That's a game changer. 27 projects across our city, not concentrated just in downtown, representing over 2800 low income housing units, have been permitted in the last 18 months.

Nothing I just described to you takes a nickel of your money, but it probably should be a requirement to get your money because the City of San Diego cannot solve our state's housing crisis by ourself. We need other jurisdictions to fight for money in Sacramento and vouchers in Washington DC.

But there's some sort of minding of your own backyard in terms of how you can help facilitate this has been so successful that this year we expanded this program to include transit oriented developments under our Complete Communities Program. And I would like to report back to this committee in a year's time what that looks like, but I have every confidence our staff will be able to hit that much quicker turnaround. Time is money. If we're saving time, it's going to reduce the cost of housing and accrue to the benefit of renters and homeowners in the not too distant future.

I hope the state would push on that.

Thank you so much.

Thank you so much for your leadership and your work, Mr. Mayor.

Assembly Member Weber.

Thank you. Thank you, Chair. I want to thank both of you for coming out, especially our mayor. I know you're very busy, so to come and give us all of this time is extremely important, and we really appreciate it. Wanna kind of piggyback off of what you were just referring to as far as housing and affordability.

You know, in your talk, you linked, appropriately, the importance of housing here, and that brings jobs and that brings retail, and also the link between, you know, housing and our unsheltered. Unfortunately, San Diego was just recently designated the most expensive city to live in this country. And so I was just wondering how you were able to create and work with developers to create more housing units here, but ensure that there is some level of affordability?

Absolutely. And hats off to Assembly Member Alvarez for carrying some legislation that actually gets to that issue. Nothing like serving in local government. You all know this well of pioneering ideas that really should be exported statewide. And that's what I saw the value of today's conversation of some of the stuff we're pioneering here can go elsewhere.

So not only did we double the number of permits from 2022 to 2023 in our city, but the diversification of the price points are pretty remarkable. I don't remember off the top of my head the precise numbers, and I want to make sure I'm giving you good information. We can follow up with the specifics. But it isn't 10,000 units at the luxury end. Our city's inclusionary housing law requires 10% of any development must be affordable.

Those ADU legislation that started at Sacramento but have been implemented with zeal here in San Diego means, again, a lot of those units are appropriate for working and middle class folks priced competitively against more luxury stuff that just happens on its own. So when you look at where the permits are, we're still not building enough, period.

We've been doing 5000 a year for the longest time. 10,000 last year is fantastic, but we really need to be at 15,000 a year for an extended period of time to create a functional housing economy that works for everybody. But the trendline is encouraging. Within those 10,000 units, you see a substantial amount at the low income level because our rules require it.

And then the market based incentives in things like our housing action plans that we've passed two of in our city, Complete Communities Program, our land development code updates, say things like, you know, if you are willing to create three bedroom units, we'll give you additional density on that site.

If you, in the case of ADUs, you can build your ADU, but if you want to build a couple more, you can do that, but you have to deed restrict some of them for low income folks. So we have created market based incentives to try and increase the production. And I think early results are fairly favorable.

Again, we're not where we want to be yet, but with very little resources. Right. We're not getting more housing vouchers from Washington DC. The state continues to make its commitments, although certainly less than in the redevelopment age. These are ways that we're seeing progress.

And nothing, nothing I just mentioned, the permitting stuff a moment ago, or what I just described now is only doable in San Diego. Whether or not other cities wish to do this is really a question. And I recognize that for some it's problematic. I don't want to lead you on. This is difficult stuff.

There are, as you know, communities are very concerned about what they call granny towers and changing their community. I just happen to believe that the change in our community by not building this housing, namely unaffordability, massive homelessness, is worse than taking a community like Little Italy, which was very different than it is today.

But it is far more vibrant and far more revered in our entire city because of the new housing that's been built there. So to your question, we are hitting price point. We're hitting the spectrum of price points, and that's because of policy. We have encouraged developers in the marketplace to start building those middle income units, etcetera.

We need to do more of that. Last thing for a pitch. You know where I'm most concerned? Generally speaking, I'm concerned about middle income housing. Think about the people who earn too much for low income housing but not enough for market rate. That's where we have to find more incentives in that space.

And we're going to continue, as Betsy mentioned, through our land development code updates to try and pioneer places. But if there's a way the state could focus in on that part of the market, I think that would be extremely beneficial. And where we have done almost nothing, and it's on my list of things to start tackling, is for sale product. I think that has a lot to do with construction defect litigation and other things. But as we've allowed the envelope to grow. You know, maybe you previously could build two houses there.

Now we're saying you can do 20. But all of it's rental. Little to none of it is for sale. That just can't be. People in California have to be able to see a future for themselves here. That includes buying a home, raising a family, building wealth. And right now we have not cracked the code on that. And again, that's perhaps something that this committee can help us with. If you can figure out what the formula is, I will happily implement it in my city.

Just briefly, I want to just underscore, and I don't think it's been appreciated as much the work that's been done here in San Diego that we've been, in some instances, been able to take to the state. Density bonus, you know, was started here. And then legislation in the State of California allowed this to happen.

This is where we allow for more development, if you, and you must commit to building affordable housing. Last year, with the support of the city and all of you, we did the same for middle income families. As the mayor speaks to low income families, we must address that. And I think there are a plethora of programs.

I am by no means saying we figured it all out. But for those individuals who are graduating college and definitely don't qualify as a low income individual, their options are really limited as well. And so this is where we expanded the density bonus program last year, again with, with your support.

And we are able to do that where, if you commit to building housing that is for middle class individuals, you can also stack your density bonus on top, which is, I think, a really good thing. More work remains to be done on that in certain parts of California. But that's a discussion for another day. I'd be really interested, Mayor, in, and I'll probably follow up with the Office of Planning and Research. But we also approved CEQA exemptions to 100% affordable housing, which is all the projects that you're talking about that you're now able to expedite in seven to nine days.

So as you do your research for next year, I'd just be interested in hearing how many of those are utilizing these CEQA exempt processes. Acknowledging that your Complete Communities work here has also led to, you know, tremendous, tremendous success in building more housing.

So housing is the first thing I want to ask about, and I want to ask you to remind us of the commitment that was made by the city, now, a few years ago, I remember this well, to ensure that downtown became a place where people also lived. You both touched on it, but it's a pretty substantial commitment. I think it's like in the 100,000 range. Remind me, and can you talk about how you see that as part of that recovery and how it's been helpful to the recovery, as this is what I think this particular question is about.

Thank you so much, Assembly Member Alvarez. I really appreciate that question. Yes. The Community Plan for Downtown, which I think was very visionary when you all approved it, was to have 90,000 units, which equates about 145,000 people living in downtown.

And when that was passed, so that 90,000 units, when that was passed, there were 22,000 units in downtown. And it seemed pretty full then, I mean, to people. So for you to have that vision. We're at about 42,000 units right now. So we have a ways to go, but we can do that. And a testament to this city is also things that we've always just thought we couldn't do. Like the 500 foot height limit for FAA. Well, that's actually not true.

And we have a height study going through right now that was funded by a foundation so that we could have an understanding of each and every parcel of downtown and which ones actually can go much higher and which ones can't. And I will say our airport authority was amazing to work with because they could have been very nervous about this, but they're not because they want to know too, and we all want to know.

And so if we can get density per site, which is what we're hoping for, we could have affordable, workforce, luxury in a mixed use product, much better and easier and much more financeable. San Jose probably has that same issue around their airport, I know for sure.

And so what the city did with their overall CEQA document for downtown was revolutionary at the time. We have a programmatic CEQA document over all of downtown that let demand development happened much faster. And so what you're doing with your Complete Communities or you, at the state level, exemption from CEQA for affordable. CEQA is important.

I understand that. But that was very helpful. So we can do the same thing with height and know every single parcel in downtown. We're going to be able to get development done so much quicker. So I think there's things like that at the state level you could do. Thank you.

Following up on that, on, you know, place making promenades. Mayor, you talked about that. I was just for an 18 trip to Denver, I was very surprised with what's happening in their downtown. And I accidentally found myself on the promenade, which I thought was quite nice. And I've been to 5th Street.

I'm just curious, from a state's perspective, what are the things that create some roadblocks towards... Because I remember being involved with a lot of fights of wanting to create different modalities for transportation, particularly bikes and walkable communities that sometimes you had to go through the whole bureaucratic process of getting approvals. Once again, CEQA. Is that something that impedes potentially something like a promenade or other activation of public spaces?

Betsy is probably better suited to answer. But just to pile on from the last conversation to your exact astute point, all that housing means that this downtown is getting new grocery stores, opening a new EV car dealership today downtown. People want to be here. And it's chicken, egg.

No, it's housing is first and then these retailers want to show up and brings job, vitality. So you're on the right track. And I think given that, God willing, we're going to cut the ribbon on the Whole Foods, like a year or so, something like that. I mean, you know, this is a positive signal for the neighborhood. Right. To your question about the promenade, it's very expensive, and that's one of our, probably our main issue now. We've closed the streets of to allow this thing to happen on 5th Avenue.

But what you saw in Denver, and I've been to that one as well, that's our long term vision of something that's more built purposefully in that way. Right. That really communicates pedestrian or welcome here. You're actually probably going to see that sooner on Normal Street in Hillcrest.

We hope to be breaking ground later this year for a promenade concept along Normal utilizing state property, the DMV. We can do better than what's currently there. So that will happen. In terms of the challenge as I see them, it's cost. And whether the state can do things that will reduce some of those costs through regulations.

I recognize in downtown, in Gaslamp, we're building in a very old environment and there's lots of old stuff down there and other stuff. I mean, no one wants to cut those corners, but a lot of that work does add cost to it. I'll tell you, one of the things that we had, probably our last stumbling block on the promenade and 5th Avenue was having to relocate a bus route. And that was not without federal review. And things like that does take things to take a bit longer.

I think if you're a business owner that really feels like, hey, I got through the pandemic by the tips of my fingers and I think this promenade could bring so many more customers. I need this to happen now. And the answer is, well, it's more than just putting some pavers out on the sidewalk.

It's so much more than that. And in many cases that's probably appropriate. But I think what we're trying to accomplish and what these projects end up looking like, stormwater diversion, access, and other things, the price tag becomes way more than a few pavers from Home Depot. Right? This becomes a very, very expensive project.

Yeah, I was going to my last question, if I can, Mr. Chair. I was around for the end of it, and you were too, of all the significant investments that were being made with the use of revenue through redevelopment bonds primarily, obviously. And I just haven't been able to figure out how can we once again think big for major catalytic projects or even civic projects like a promenade when cities don't have the resources to do that?

I know the budget of City of San Diego, you don't got money to just do a nice new project, right? You've got to find a source of revenue to do that. So how do we once again allow big things to happen in light of the really only tool available for urban development?

It's different when you've got green development because it's new dev fees and all that stuff you can collect. But in an urban environment, in older communities, which downtown is, and the communities a lot of that I represent are, there is no other way to come up with a funding source. I'd love to hear your thoughts in your conversations with other cities, both of you, to see how folks are doing that.

I can try quickly and then Betsy can clean up afterward. Is yes, if I had more resources, I could do anything you'd ask me to. You want me to build a promenade? You want it mañana. I can do it, no problem. But the resources, as you note, are not there.

I think to your point about going big, the Normal Street promenade benefits from federal, state, and SANDAG funding. So when you all invest, we can do that. Soon you can go to the Hillcrest Farmers Market. It's going to be gorgeous and you're going to love it. When I think big right now, I think about EFIDs.

There's one in your Assembly District around Otay Mesa, which is helping us do critical infrastructure that wouldn't be there otherwise, and that's helping economic development in our border community. And so the state allows those to be, and we're sort of dabbling with it. It's not the same as redevelopment, but at least it's there.

We're going to try and use that same model at the sports arena redevelopment not far from here and start something that'll be transformational. I think for your colleagues who aren't from San Diego, it's currently a 48 acre parking lot with a 1960s arena on it.

Our vision is a 21st century arena with 4250 homes, half of which are affordable. So, I mean, we're counting on that tool to make that happen. And then we might replicate that at the Civic Center, the six blocks of downtown San Diego the City of San Diego owns that we could redo, hopefully with an EFID as well as at SPAWAR or NAVWAR. I'm sorry, NAVWAR, the Navy's IT outfit. It's about almost 30 acres or slightly less than that, where similar format can be.

That's the only way I can think of big projects currently to try and get to the resource issue that you're describing. But we haven't necessarily implemented this, I think, on the scale that you and I are both thinking about in our heads. And it's going to be interesting to see if this can work.

The folks at Midway Rising tell me this will work there, and we have buy in from the county now and elsewhere. So I'm hopeful. But I think for those of us who remember old redevelopment eras, will it be the same? I don't know, but that's where we're doing big stuff, and we're counting on EFIDs to be the tool that delivers those. Betsy, anything's coming to mind to you?

I think the mayor covered a lot of what is exciting and what is to come, but the more flexibility we have from the state to do special districts and maybe capture that money and keep it in that area would be very helpful for this because we want to benefit the entire community. It's not like we're taking the money to keep it. We're putting it right back into that plaza or whatever it is.

So we could maybe do some pilots around that. Civic Center or NAVWAR could be a good example here in San Diego to try that and see how it works. Because I do have that same concern or worry about these big projects that we want to do and how do we get the funding.

And I think back to even projects when I worked in city hall as a staffer from 2000 to 2008, and even when we had redevelopment and coupling state and federal and SANDAG and all these different funding sources together is quite difficult. And it takes a sustained, like, five to 10 year vision from an elected official to do and then the team to put it together. So if we had even a pilot maybe in each city to try, that could be really interesting and compelling.

Well, Ms. Brennan, Mr. Mayor, thank you so much for your time this morning, for all you're doing. I think you really laid out for us both the challenges and the opportunities in front of us and the ways in which the work that we can do at the state can support the vision that you have for this city that really, I think, all of our state can benefit from.

You underscored for us, I think, why we chose to have this hearing here in San Diego. A lot of folks, when I talk to them about the success that San Diego is having, they often say, well, they have the weather and they have the location, and that must be it. But really, it's leadership. And you all are taking advantage of the great city that you have and the great tacos, and making sure that your creative, proactive leadership is taking it to the future in a moment of tremendous change. And so we're grateful for your leadership.

I also want to recognize that both of you have staff who are also, many of them whom are here, who are also a huge part of that. And I want to acknowledge and recognize them and their work, as well as the business leaders, Council Member Whitburn as well, who has been a tremendous leader for downtown.

A lot more to come, and you've given us a lot to think about. And you have representatives here and partners at the state who are going to continue to support the work that you're doing. Thank you for being with us. Appreciate it. All right, we are going to now move to our next panel.

Next couple panels are going to give us the opportunity to do a bit more of a deep dive around some of the themes that we touched on in this first panel. I want to move to our second panel, which will focus on nightlife and culture as an anchor for safe, clean, and healthy downtowns.

I want to invite up our three panelists, Qiana Conley Akinro, Senior Executive Director for the Los Angeles Chapter of the Recording Academy, Ben Bleiman, who is the President of the California Nightlife Association, and Joe Rinaldi, who is the Managing Partner of Music Box San Diego. Welcome.

All right, Kiana, I think we're starting with you. Welcome.

Thank you.

Everyone. I just want to say, first of.

All, on behalf.

There we go. Sorry. Thank you, everyone. I just wanted to say, on behalf of Harvey Mason Junior, our CEO, and the Recording Academy, we thank the California Assembly Select Committee on downtown Recovery, Assembly Members, and obviously the Legislative aid of Assembly Member Haney for inviting us to be a part of the conversation today.

Again, my name is Qiana Conley Akinro. I am the senior Executive Director for the Los Angeles chapter of the Recording Academy. And what we do at the Recording academy is we are a hub for music creators and music professionals. We are most famously known for our biggest night in music, which is the Grammys.

But there is much more work that we do the other 364 days of the year, and I'm here to share a little bit about what that work is, as well as a little bit about what we think sort of the State of importance around need for music creators and music professionals in terms of being supported by the state.

So again, many people know the Recording Academy best for the Grammy Awards when we recognize excellence in the recording industry through music's most coveted and only peer recognized award. But the Grammys is just one of 365 days that we spend working to support the music industry and its creators.

As the leading community of music professionals, the Recording Academy's purpose is to advocate for our community by fighting for the rights of all music creators to ensure pro music policy is enacted at the national, state and local levels. We inspire the next generation of the industry through enrichment, education and mentorship.

And we cultivate the well being of the music community through service and galvanize our own community to serve the world around us.

As the senior Executive Director of the LA chapter, it is my job to specifically engage the music community and advocate with Members in various markets inclusive of all of the State of Arizona, all of our Members in the State of New Mexico, all of our Members in southern Nevada, and of course, all of our Members in Southern California, which obviously includes the great City of San Diego.

Therefore, it's my pleasure and my honor to be here with you today and share on a few things that we thought would be important to this conversation of creating opportunities in local scenes that are bursting with talent like San Diego today. I'd like to invite us to share on three particular areas.

One, who exactly makes up the music community of California through some key data points. What we believe the State of need is for the California music community and what the work of the recording academy is in regards to advocating specifically around policy for music creators. And then why?

Through a brief comment on our historical, cultural and economic importance of music, musicians, music venues and the recording industry in California. So first and foremost, a little bit of the history.

California, as you know, has been the home of a vital, diverse and impactful music community of artists, songwriters, studio professionals, record labels, publishers, even lawyers and publicists all throughout the entire state, not just in Hollywood or Los Angeles where I drove from today, genres and icons have been born and defined here.

California is the home of West Coast hip hop, the Bakersfield sound, chicano music and surfer rock. Not to mention the impacts of our state has had on music like folk, r and b, punk rock and pop.

From Miles Davis to Kendrick Lamar, Etta James to Billie Eilish, the Beach Boys to blink 182, I could spend hours naming icon after icon, legendary band after legendary band who called California their home and many of which were born here.

California is also home to iconic venues like the Fillmore in San Francisco, the Troubadour in Hollywood and the Kazba here in San Diego, and countless more. It is the destination for incredible music festivals like Coachella, which alone brought in 250 visitors and generated 704 million in economic activity, including spending by consumers and 106 million in indio alone.

And California remains the capital of recorded music, with studios like the village and Capitol studios producing some of the most legendary and popular music ever created. So what does this mean in terms of our economic value?

The current value of music to the state's creative economy, according to research conducted by the RIAA, is 39.5 billion in the music industry contribution to state GDP, which is 430,814 jobs supported by the industry.

There are 71,000 music venues across the state, according to data from Neva, which is the national independent venues Association, and hundreds of thousands of royalty recipients, according to Soundexchange and the songwriter performing rights organizations like ASCAP and BMI.

According to Otis College report on the Creative Economy, the overall creative economy directly contributed 507.4 billion to California's economy and 7.6% of its jobs. The report's analysis also showed that the creative sectors outperformed the overall economy and post Covid recovery.

So obviously, through policy and economic development, venues and venues and industry, we can support the promise that the music community and the entertainment community bring to the development of downtown recovery within the State of California as a whole.

Now, speaking specifically, and this is my last section, sorry gentlemen, just wanted to speak specifically about what the music advocacy work of the Recording academy has been in 2024, we've been advocating specifically for legislation and policies that have a positive impact on the music community, which is central to the mission of our recording academy.

Myself and the other 11 Executive directors throughout the entire nation actually work on a day that we've been coining district advocate where we meet with congressional and senatorial leaders and our Members. We usually have about 2000 or so of our Members across the nation that meet on the same day. This year it's called Music Advocacy Day.

We've renamed it, and it's October 1. We also do a lot of state policy activation as well, and have participated in the California Day of the Arts, most recently in March of 2024.

We represent the voices of performers, songwriters, producers, engineers, and all music creators across genres and crafts who come from different backgrounds and communities throughout the country. It's our responsibility to protect creators rights and advance their interests on important music policy matters, whether it's in their local communities or on the state and federal levels.

And we specifically like to mention that because though our membership may be about 25,000 or so, we all know someone who is in the music business or a young kid who is interested in pursuing music as a professional career.

So a lot of the work that we do may be through the hands and the voices of our Members, but it really is benefiting music creators and music professionals as a whole. As you know, are the people that typically are supporting the General public and the different experiences that they're going through in their life as well.

So the Recording academy has endorsed and is working on two bills that are actively being considered right now in Sacramento that would provide immediate benefit to music creators and the state's creative economy. The first deals with the modest new regulations around generative AI.

The Bill we have endorsed, AB 1836, protects deceased individuals from having their likeness used without permission. AB 1836 addresses a critical gap in California's current right of publicity law by extending protections to include deceased creators. California law currently permits the use of digital replicas of deceased individuals without their families or their estates permission.

So this legislation would rectify this by providing posthumous, posthumous, excuse me, protection for creators, ensuring that their likeness is not used without authorization, and provides solutions to harmonize protections and ensure that every Californian retains control over their digital identity. Why is this important?

It's about extending the lifeblood and the generations of these creators and providing opportunities for the legacy, you know, that that would be benefiting from these rights. AB 1836 cleared the Assembly in May and is hopefully moving forward soon in the Senate to reach the governor's desk to become law.

The second Bill is close to the conversation of today and deals with the live event marketplace and ensuring that buying tickets to concerts and shows protects artists and their fans. SB 785 protects artists and their fans by stopping fraudulent and deceptive practices in the ticketing marketplace.

So SB 785 ends the predatory practice of resellers selling fake tickets to consumers. It also prohibits deceptive websites that are created to mimic the primary ticket sellers website in an attempt to trick consumers into buying fake or overpriced tickets.

It also requires ticket advertisers, ticket resellers and ticket marketplaces to disclose the face value of the ticket being sold and has already crossed over to the Assembly. We are hopeful that this will be brought up imminently to become law before the end of the session.

So additionally, and I mentioned this a little bit earlier, but in April, both our Los Angeles chapter and our San Francisco chapters participated in California for the arts annual advocacy in the state Capitol, and we continue to advocate specifically around music education.

Other than that, in closing, I just, you know, again, would like to say thank you for giving us the time, and happy to answer any questions about how we think focusing on downtown recovery, particularly in the space of creating opportunities for music creators and their fans to gather and to connect, will have great impact on economic development, as well as just lifestyle and social interaction amongst the communities.

So thanks for having me.

Thank you so much, Gianna, for being here and for joining us today and for really laying out how central our creators are to California's history, its economy, its culture, and how we can leverage this as we think about our downtowns, the recovery, and their economic and cultural impact and potential.

I'm now going to turn it over to Ben Bleiman, who is the President of the California Nightlife Association.

Hello. Thank you for having me. It's an honor. My name is Ben Blymon. As Assemblymember Haney said, I have owned 12 bars in the City of San Francisco. I'm from the San Francisco contingent. I'm also currently the President of the San Francisco Entertainment Commission, which interfaces between neighbors and sound in a very innovative way.

I'm here on my personal time now, speaking on my own behalf, and I'm the founder of the California Nightlife Association, which is a relatively new statewide nightlife advocacy organization that we founded specifically to meet a need in the state, and that's to advocate for workers, for venue owners, for artists, for performers kind of across the state.

We have board Members from San Diego, from Orange County, from LA. We have Oakland, Sacramento, San Francisco, and we're trying to find Baker and Bakersfield in Fresno. So if you know anybody, we would love to have them aboard. So here today, obviously we're talking about downtowns. And it's funny because I currently do own a bar in downtown.

I have one now, which is great. But before I owned that bar, which is very recent, I didn't think much about downtowns until Covid hit. And the reason was when downtowns are going well and you don't live or work there, it's just kind of. You take them for granted.

It's when they start to go south that everybody realize how connected downtowns are to the health of an individual city or town. You already know this, but I think it's just bears saying, obviously there's a lot of reasons that our downtowns are struggling. Covid was the main one, a flight of people who live downtown out.

Homelessness, safety issues. I think the most important one for San Francisco, and I think for many, is the work from home phenomenon, which was kind of very fast exodus of a massive group of people who spent a lot of money downtown and went there every single day.

So we realize San Francisco, I'm sure in San Diego, LA, just how important our downtowns are for our tax basis, for tourism conferences and all the dollars they bring in. And then it's self perpetuating when downtown start to deteriorate. People don't want to go down there and it gets worse and worse and worse.

And so you create kind of a snowball effect, which is we've seen, at least in our city, to be really, really detrimental. So what we've realized, or what my philosophy is, and what Cal Knight stands for is that people used to go downtown because they had to. Primarily, especially workers, they were required. There wasn't a choice.

That's where their office was. It was a five day work from the office situation. But now the only reason they would go downtown, or many of them, is because they would want to.

And so part of our recovery for our downtown areas needs to be focused on giving people reasons to want to return while before we would just have to provide additional things for them who are already there. Right?

So this is why I kind of argue, and I think I could win a debate, that entertainment and nightlife is not just an integral part of downtown. I think it actually, to me is probably the most important driving factor for bringing people downtown. I'm talking entertainment, nightlife, arts, performance.

All of these things that can happen day or night, but are in that same genre of kind of hospitality, performance, arts, entertainment. These are the things that bring people to downtown to go back to their office. These are the reasons that people would want to even live in downtowns and new developments and things.

They want to be around activity. People don't move downtown for quiet. They don't move downtown for restful evenings. They move because they want to be in the middle of the action. And it's up to the nightlife community to provide that action for them.

So San Francisco, no different, I'm certain, than here, where we're really putting nightlife on the forefront. So that just gets down to kind of why we're here, which is how can the state help? Right.

This is why I'm so excited that we've, that Cal Knight's here and that Assembly Member Haney and you all have put together this Select Committee, because I think there's a lot of places the state can assist.

So the state, I think, has two General columns, like where they can help pave the way and where they can help the state get out of the way. Right. And paving the way. We've seen a lot of things. Right.

So take even the laws that have been put in the last decades on benefit districts, whether the community benefit districts or bids or all the other things, these are incredibly efficient uses of taxpayer dollars. It is remarkable. Full disclosure, I run a community benefit district, a small one. It's a paid job.

It's not downtown in San Francisco, but just you're able to see how that money can be spent so prudently to directly benefit the people right. In that neighborhood, rather being spread out amongst a whole area. There's also this entertainment zone idea.

The bar that I have in downtown San Francisco has the first designated entertainment zone in the state. Directly outside of it. These are incredibly innovative zones. There's a Bill called SB 969 right now, which cleared Committee yesterday, one of the committees, and that is helping to extend entertainment zones across the state.

The beauty of these entertainment zones is the city gets to kind of decide how to apply them, whether or not they're once in a while, just on special occasions, whether it's every single day. And it just gives the cities flexibility to do what they need to do. And then obviously, there are things like tax incentives.

The State of Texas does some really interesting tax incentives. I know probably not this legislative session, but when California gets back on its feet again, they do things for hiring live musicians. For example, in the State of Texas, there's a tax credit for business is to hire live musicians. They use it from an alcohol tax there.

But there's no reason that can't be done. There's also major, major issues on a wonky side with insurance for nightlife venues right now. And the state has a lot of power over insurance.

And so we're looking at different ways that the state might be able to influence that, either on a, just from a policy standpoint or from more of a conversation with insurance brokers, et cetera.

I think the beauty and the General idea with the state helping to pave the way is the state can create circumstances that then the localities can take advantage of on getting out of the way.

Really the only thing I can think of, other than zoning for housing and all those other adjacent things, is that we are governed, often nightlife industries by the ABC, the alcohol beverage control, and it's filled with really well meaning good people. It was created 75 years ago to stop corruption that came directly after the end of prohibition.

And so it's kind of crazy that we have a, you know, a Department in the state that is overseeing all these different places. I actually think they do a very good job considering. But there are certain instances where they can use help with more resources and they're, and they're begging for them.

There are also certain instances where they could use help getting over some of their more bureaucratic tendencies. And I think our state can do, can help guide them to overcome some of the bureaucracy. So they resemble a body that a little more resembles something that's lean and mean and helpful and flexible than the DMV itself.

So those are kind of some of the basic ideas. I'm here again, honored to be here and thank you for listening.

Thank you so much, Ben, for being here and for your leadership. And that is such an important thing to have a statewide Association that is focusing on such a critical part of our state's economy and certainly of our downtime recovery. Next we have Joe Ronaldi, who's a managing partner of music Box San Diego.

Thanks so much for being here, Joe, and for sharing with us a bit about what this looks like in your world and in your city.

Thanks so much for having me, Committee. I really appreciate being here. Before I get started, what we do at Music Box San Diego. It's a 705 person venue in the Columbia district, often mistaken for the little Italy District of San Diego. We have received so much support from the downtown partnership in our nine years of existence.

To see Betsy Brennan up here speaking on these issues well reflected in the community, in our time in business, we also have received a great deal of support from the mayor's office. We've had staff provided to us out of Mayor Gloria's office for the duration of as long as he's been mayor.

They've provided support to the best of their abilities, to listen to what venues we're going through during the time of COVID to help us with ongoing issues and to tackle a lot of the things that we talked about today, about how to get out of the way and get business is empowered to participate in the economy to the best of their abilities.

Understanding the agenda today that we're watching a sea change in downtown landscapes of work from home and how it's affecting the economy.

One of the things we're proudest of in our aspect of the nightlife business is we tend to think that we fight blight, that we go into slightly underserved parts of the community, provide a baseline from which restaurants can start and housing can start and communities can get involved.

And some of the proof of concept specific to that in the City of San Diego that we're proudest of. And I don't want to take credit for other people's work, but a gentleman named Rob Hagee did come in and initiate something called street scene in the late eighties, which turned into the revitalization of the gas lamp district.

Full stop. It was a music festival that taught everybody about what was then the wild west of the downtown area of San Diego. And through 23 years of activity in a music festival, out of it came Gaslamp redevelopment, Petco redevelopment.

All of the housing initiatives that we spent some part of today hearing about it came from those types of entertainment options that taught the entire city about what downtown had to offer. We are never going to be done finding another follow.

Part of what was earlier described as treasures all throughout San Diego County and then taking them and turning them into other economic activity. There's tons of economic study to show the fact that any dollar spent within our industry results in $12 being spent in the community. It's the loop study. You can Google it.

It's well founded and it's a central part of a lot of the work that we do when we're out there asking for assets, for nightlife, to try to go and have nightlife be a big principal part of how to affect downtowns positively in the face of changes that are coming out.

I listened a lot to the earlier part of the conversation. I understand the agenda is how we can all help each other.

One of the things that I would suggest for the City of San Diego to just basically embark on a best practices endeavor is to learn from some of the other municipalities in the state, specifically with how they attack agendas of the nighttime economy. In San Francisco, there is a person colloquially called the nighttime mayor.

His name's Ben Van Houtenous. It takes all of the energy you heard in the first hour about housing, all of the energy you heard about that type of economic development. It gives that same sort of advocacy to where I'm employing as a small business in my sector of the economy.

We talked about how to have a 24 hours economy currently in our city. We need to reconcile that. We definitely have. Most recent transactions involve removing cabaret licenses from venues, not enhancing them. So our latest licensed venue in our city is a place called spin nightclub. It's very popular within the dance community.

A lot of you may or not have heard of it, but they did not get to continue having a cabaret license just in the last 18 months. And this is in the conversation of understanding how to actually lengthen and go towards a 04:00 a.m. across the state.

We would want to try to work in partnership with the ABC and their initiatives to understand. Like another example, I advocate for the National Independent Venue Association. I worked very hard on the state legislation that made the type 90 Bill happen.

Type liquor licenses are a provision of the state, but they're also deeply affected by city involvement and municipal involvement. That municipal involvement involves an entertainment permit in the the City of San Diego that adjoins all of those liquor licenses. They're only as good as each other.

So we would really want to have somebody along the lines of a nighttime economic advocate to ensure that we don't make some great progress in the state infrastructure, whether it be a type 90 license or similar, and then have it unable to be affected in our community because we are using provisions of entertainment permitting that are left over from the old types of liquor licenses.

Anyway, the specific ask in that initiative is we probably should look within the city as to how to better represent my sector of the economy within the halls of government. Not that there's not great intent there is.

Not that there's not great energy, as we witnessed earlier today, but specifically channeling and filtering that intent into our part of the economy would be a great way to reconcile the work that you would like to do today with your Committee and what's available to us as a resource.

Lastly, I heard an awful lot about things like the midway development. I heard a lot of things about Rady Shell. Those are great. They're going to be great initiatives when they're built. And Rady is already a national treasure. I agree with all of those things. There's also tons of things that we could do today.

And we have to be sure that we are understanding what we have as an inventory today and what we could be possibly doing to enhance the San Diego economy in our city.

In my business, if you count the vertical capacities of the venues that are available to hold concerts, you think of the sports arena, you think of the observatory at 1000 and then you think that there's nothing with the roof in between them. That's a problem.

If you have San Francisco with Bill Graham's Civic auditorium at 9500 and you realize that that same facility doesn't exist in the City of San Diego, that's a problem. What that means to us is that's not an economic opportunity available to us.

We could be selling 9500 tickets in a downtown corridor and putting that economic activity at $12 perennial into our economy. We have facilities here now that could be revitalized and put into play.

I know some part of this because I spent some time working at a venue called Forth and be, which is now a construction site up the street and inside that same quarter is another venue called Golden hall that hasn't been used in 20 years.

It could, it is, I think, four permits away from housing 4500 person concerts in a General admission facility. We've also spoken with the Port of San Diego about the B street terminal which also would have a capacity of 4000.

We could put those things into business today and start an economic resurgence in those districts which are a bit sleepy at this time and provide some sort of positive benefit to it. I look forward to any of those conversations at any time.

I just wanted to put tangible examples out of things I think you are suggesting that I think are available to us. I appreciate the time.

Thank you so much, Joe. And thank you to the entire panel. I think you all really highlighted a few things. One is just how inextricably intertwined local and state policymaking and decisions are when it comes to nightlife and entertainment.

So much of the laws, whether it's ones that help or get in the way our state policies and the interaction between these and what we can also learn from various other jurisdictions is key.

I also really appreciate the comment that we need to move towards seeing nightlife, entertainment, music events as central and essential to our downtowns and their economic vitality, particularly in this moment of change that. That we're experiencing.

I think we've begun to move in that direction, as you mentioned, when it comes to housing and there's a lot that comes to that, we make it a lot easier to build housing. We have people whose jobs it is to make sure we advocate for those types of housing developments, particularly when it comes to our downtowns.

But do we have that same energy when it comes to the essential role that events and music and nightlife has?

If there's a new development and we're going to be growing in a certain area, or there's a certain need in a downtown, are we making sure that nightlife is central to that and always included in that and has a champion, whether it's an actual person who's helping or within the laws that really make it and facilitate it to be a part of the success of any effort around economic development.

Colleagues are there. I know we're running a little bit behind, so we're. But if there are any questions or comments, I just.

Yeah, I also just want to thank all of you. You know, I love downtowns. I get excited hearing about them, hearing how people are invested in them. I want to thank Mister Kenro for your advocacy on behalf of artists, recording artists. I think definitely a quintessential California industry.

Especially if you add on, then, you know, the Hollywood and the studios, what have you. I have a Bill AB 2602 to protect performers from AI basically without at least having some representation, ability to have some control over that. So I appreciate your work in that space.

And Mister Rinaldi was talking to the investment in some of the places that you would love to see open up again, what have you. I mean, when we had redevelopment, I know that this is one of the venues that was able to get revitalized in San Jose. We had the California theater. And there's examples throughout the state.

And so we have to get more creative now because we don't necessarily have those resources. And I think one thing that I'll just ask for any comment, because I think that you all referred to and the importance. And I think you can't have a vibrant community without vibrant life. Live entertainment, particularly live music.

But at the same time, as we were talking earlier, Miss Brennan was talking about bringing people into the downtown, especially young people. And they talk about that third place that people need to go to work slash school and home. What's that third place? Now it could be a place like this.

And you can pay a high price ticket to see a great show. But we need those places that are either inexpensive or free for folks. And that's where you get these promenades that may have live entertainment and what have you.

How do we encourage that these places where we can have people to gather together that is not always reliant on having to buy a ticket, but just creates that vibrancy because maybe that young person that can't buy a ticket today, 10 years from now, will buy that ticket, but you have to bring them into that, into that community and create that kind of cultural community.

Any thoughts on that?

I'd love to start with that. One of the things I didn't mention, and I'm happy to have your question, because I was trying to figure out how I was going to like, you know, weave it in there.

But one of the things that the Recording academy does, I didn't mention our affiliate organizations, which include our nonprofit sister organizations.

We're technically a not for profit, which most people don't realize that we are a 501 C six, but we have 2501 s, one being musicaires, which their daily work is focused on music creators and professionals in need. So we deal with things like recovery. We deal with things like addiction recovery.

We deal with financial hardship. Musicares also looks at just a number of things. Sorry, my brain is going numb on that. But really what I wanted to emphasize was the Grammy Museum foundation, which is actually celebrating its 15th year.

And it's housed, speaking of downtowns, in this conversation, today it's housed in downtown Los Angeles and a big sort of gathering place for much of Southern California in LA.

Live right in that space, you have not only the museum, which does have hours that are more extended than your typical museums, where most museums shut down by four or five. The Grammar museum offers programming that is Low cost or even sometimes educational programming that's free to the community you're specifically talking about to the next generation.

It's focused as the Garment Museum foundation is focused on music preservation and of course, the next generation of creators.

So much of the educational programming that they provide on weekends, sometimes and evenings during the week, and that is bringing people to downtown Los Angeles, is specifically targeted at high school and younger, and getting them introduced not only to music and the potential of it as a professional, as a profession, but also the importance of us as a society extending the lifeblood and honoring sort of the creativity that's come before as we're looking at also exposing them.

Communities, particularly that are black and brown or represent a lot of BIPOC that might be underrepresented or underserved, are actually brought to this downtown hub to not only be exposed to music through the museums, but also have a direct connect to what's right next door, crypto.com comma, or these other venues.

There's restaurants, there's bars, there's other independent performance venues that are right in that same community. And so it's creating this generational connection and importance of downtown as a hub for all things creative, which I think is another way of thinking about what a downtown development could offer.

Just a quick, just a quick thought. So there's a right way to do it and a wrong way to do it, and there's a lot of wrong ways to do it.

And so being a part of the first entertainment zone in the state right now, I could probably write a PhD thesis on the amount of time and effort we're putting into how to do this right. There's a lot of pressure on us right now.

What I learned is that a lot of people think, just close down the street, throw some cornhole out there. In fact, permanent street closures, over 80% fail. They fail for the businesses. They fail. People don't show up.

And so I think what people don't realize, and we've seen this in San Francisco as well, where they shut down a street and they're like, here come the people, and nobody shows up.

I think closing down streets temporarily at first, but you have to put a lot of thought and money into programming them and making them beautiful and making them interesting from artistic plant life, seeding arrangements, etcetera, and then programming them correctly with ways.

But I think exactly what she was saying before is that you can start what we're doing. You start with a temporary closure, but go big on it and create that connection. Make the people learn that when they do this, it really works. And it's. And it's amazing. And then try to go for more frequently after that.

And then. So I think that's the way. And I think the state, you know, unfortunately, right now, the state's in a budget crisis. But we're all, I think, hoping that sometime when it's not, that the state will put investments, whether they're tax incentives or grant dollars or whatever they can do, into these proven things that have existed.

But certainly entertainment zones, if done correctly, is going to be very, very helpful. And to be honest, you don't need entertainment zones to shut a street and have people out there. They just make it a lot easier, bureaucratic, bureaucratically, to, to have the alcohol, essentially. So thank you.

Thank you for that. And I think that one of the things that we're looking at is, as you all sort of laid out, some of the history of how nightlife has been viewed by the state as more something to crack down on or control or prevent. Now we have to really shift the way that we think about policymaking, both at the local and state level, to understand how central and essential it is to our economy, to our culture, and certainly in this moment to our downtowns and their revitalization.

And so that's a part of what we need to do, is it's changing these laws to allow the flexibility that cities need, whether that's the entertainment zones, which simply allows cities to be able to have areas where people can purchase alcohol and have it out on the street and have more of a festival like atmosphere on a more regular basis with complete adaptability for what is best for a city.

And, you know, one of the efforts that I couldn't have this conversation without mentioning the changes that need to happen on hours of operation and allowing for more individual flexibility for a city in their closing times and times that they're able to serve, I think we make it very difficult for our essential nightlife businesses to be able to thrive if they're really only able to make money between 11:00 p.m. and 01:30 a.m. And also that has public safety consequences as well when everybody's flooding into the street at 02:00 a.m.

So I think that those are the sort of things that we need to think about as we're shifting from a control and punishment and prevention type of policy making and regulation to one that is more about facilitation of such an essential industry. And I think the conversation around downtown recovery is a huge part of that. I want to thank all three of you for being here and for your time. I love to see that Joe's got a little wristband on right there. That's what I'm talking about. Practicing what he preaches there. It might just because those are really hard to get off. I barely got off my Outside Lands one just recently.

That's what it is. See? You know, it's on forever. That's Outside Lands. That's great. Well, thank you so much to all three of you and really appreciate it and look forward to continuing to working together. Thank you. All right, we will call up our last panel now, and I recognize we are running a little bit behind. So we lost a couple of our folks here, but we want to continue the conversation and invite up our next panel on hospitality and tourism as an economic stabilizer in struggling downtowns. We have Nick Johnson, who's the Director of Public Policy at Lyft, and Kavin Schieferdecker, the Chief Sales Officer at the San Diego Tourism Authority. Welcome. And we're grateful to have the two of you here. And whenever you're ready, Nick, I think we're going to start with you.

I'll be quick. I know we're running quick on time. But thank you Chair Haney, Members of the Committee. I'd like to thank you for looking how to revitalize and recover our downtowns and cities. This is something that is very important to Lyft. We were founded with the vision to improve cities by redesigning them around people, not cars. This vision sought to increase transportation options for people if they did not live in or near city's downtown area and allow people to forego the cost of car ownership with the confidence that they could still get where they want, when they want. Our rides right now are bringing people back into the city and helping communities stay connected and businesses thrive.

Transportation is the essential momentum that gets people out of their houses and experiencing life, which is very important to us as well. And transportation is essential to any type of downtown comeback. Lyft provides economic opportunity for our drivers, riders, and their surrounding communities. We're proud of our role of bringing riders back into these city centers and unexplored parts of their neighborhoods. And I think also very importantly, what gets lost with rideshare is that we're associated with decreasing the amount of impaired driving incidents.

In San Diego alone, 73% of our riders choose Lyft when they plan on drinking alcohol or using some other substance that might impair them from driving. And that's something to think about when the California Legislature is looking at Bills to expand nightlife options in the state. That rideshare is a way to reduce public, I'm sorry, reduce impaired driving incidents and make communities safer. At Lyft, we believe that one ride can set the future in motion. But in order to do that, we have to remove barriers and find creative solutions for communities to get where they need to go. Lyft is critical for communities across the country.

50% of our riders are people of color, and 43% of the rides start or end in low income neighborhoods. And given the role that we play in those communities, it's important to us to show up for people, not only through our investments in social impact programs, but also partnerships with transit departments, event venues, hospitals and airports. And this is terribly important because we have a couple of global events coming to California over the next two to four years

And these partnerships are valuable, making sure that people can get A to B, which is going to be a pretty big challenge when it comes to Los Angeles Olympics and the World Cup for sure. We also want to develop more public and private partnerships to ensure transportation is not a barrier to access downtowns. A one size fits all approach to transportation is not the way forward. And let's partner and invest in transportation options that make sense for the future to make a more connected transportation ecosystem.

Connecting people, whether it's downtown or otherwise, is not only good for the economy, but it's healthy for our lives. As the Surgeon General said, social connection is the fundamental human need, like water or shelter. And we believe that. We think that we are a bridge between drivers and riders physical worlds and their digital worlds, right? And I think that a lot of people have been, as our CEO puts it, wrapped up in the digital world and we're trying to bring people back outside. So thank you for the time and happy to discuss any type of transportation solutions that Lyft could provide.

Thank you so much. And it's great to have you here. And we could have an entire conversation around this sort of transportation element of this. But we think it's a very important perspective, particularly when we're thinking about nightlife, because in many cases there aren't the transportation options that exist late at night except for rideshare and sort of to think about how that fits into the perspective alongside, of course, public transportation, is critically important. I'll now turn it over to you, Kavin.

Good afternoon, Chair Haney and Assemblymember Alvarez. My name is Kavin Schieferdecker and I serve as the Chief Sales Officer for the San Diego Tourism Authority. I have a quick 4-5 minutes opening statement and then I'll take questions. We are the San Diego Tourism Authority, a private, nonprofit, mutual benefit corporation composed of almost 1000 member organizations, businesses, local governments and individuals seeking a better community through the visitor industry.

As a sales and marketing organization, the main objective of the tourism authority is to promote and market the San Diego region throughout the world as a preferred vacation and meeting destination. In pursuing our mission, we recognize the strength of our tourism industry is linked to the vitality of a downtown San Diego. The role of our organization has in helping to keep our downtown vibrant is multifaceted and includes, one, the economic impact that visitors bring downtown. Two, the jobs the tourism industry creates.

Three, our senior staff actively participates in community centered committees that help create policy, infrastructure improvements, long term planning and drive revenues to downtown businesses, including the downtown San Diego Partnership, San Diego Regional Chamber, Economic Development Corporation, the Civic Core Revitalization Project, the new Navy Seal Museum and Forever Balboa Park, just to name a few.

And four, through our visitor profile study and other tools, such as a Tourism Stewardship Plan, we provide the city stakeholders and partners analytics that help drive improvements, for example, understanding where our visitors are spending most of their time and their money, the demographics of our visitors, how San Diego compares to other competing destinations and what things should we do better to attract more visitors and retain the market share we currently have. Today, I'd like to focus on the area that exemplifies the synergy between a vibrant urban area and tourism success.

San Diego's downtown stands as the beating heart of a vibrant industry of tourism. A dynamic ecosystem where residential living, work and leisure converge seamlessly in our hospitality sector. The significance of a vibrant downtown San Diego to our tourism industry cannot be overstated, as evidenced by the impressive economic indicators and high profile events we host here in San Diego.

In 2023, downtown hotels sold 4 million room nights at an average daily rate of $247, generating nearly $1 billion of revenue and $105 million to the city's Transient Occupancy Tax. This robust performance mirrors San Diego's broader tourism impact, which reaches an impressive $22 billion annually, with visitors spending $14.3 billion and generating $1 billion in tax revenues. Tourism not only fuels the local economy but also provides an estimated $1,000 of tax relief per household to San Diego residents.

As the second largest industry in San Diego, tourism accounts for one in eight jobs, underscoring its critical role in the community's prosperity. Downtown's appeal is multifaceted, featuring 73 hotels ranging from Marquee Brands including Marriott, Hilton and Hyatt to luxury hotels like the Pendry to boutique properties such as Pally Hotel and Horton Grand, totaling 15,000 rooms, 39% of San Diego's tourism marketing district's total inventory, yet 43.5% of the district's total guest room revenue in fiscal year '23.

The area boasts 500 accommodation and food service establishments complemented by 90 arts, culture and entertainment venues, creating a rich tapestry of experiences for both leisure and business travelers. From the historic Gas Lamp Quarter that we've talked about much this morning to the stunning waterfront, from Major League Baseball's top rated Petco Park to the USS Midway Museum honoring the city's military heritage, downtown San Diego offers a blend of history, culture, arts and present day amenities.

The diversity not only attracts leisure travelers, but also cements San Diego's position as a premier destinations for meetings and conventions. This status among business event professionals in North America is not just industry chatter, it's backed by hard data and prestigious recognition. Cvent, the world's leading provider of meetings, events and hospitality technology, has consistently acknowledged San Diego as a top five meetings and convention city in the United States

And last year the Wall Street Journal added its influential voice, naming the iconic San Diego Convention Center as the fourth best convention center in the United States. This impressive placement isn't just about the facility itself, it's a testament to our city's downtown overall appeal. The ranking gave high marks to San Diego for its exceptional qualities as a destination, its abundance of pleasant weather, the convenient proximity of the airport to the downtown area, and, perhaps most importantly, the walkability of our city center.

This combination of a world class convention center and an irresistible urban environment solidifies San Diego's reputation as a go-to destination for events of all sizes, from intimate corporate retreats to major international conferences. A prime example of downtown's drawing power is our annual Comic Con International. This four day event, held every July, attracted 135,000 attendees just last month, producing an economic impact for the region of $164 million and generating over $3 million in hotel and sales tax revenues for the City of San Diego. These tax revenues directly support essential city services.

The conventions impact ripples throughout the local economy, benefiting hotels, restaurants, attractions, AB companies, printers, designers, photographers, transportation providers, caterers, grocery stores, dry cleaners and the list goes on. San Diego is the envy of so many destinations across the country, from a tourism and convention aspect, and a vibrant downtown core is such a critical component of our success.

By fostering a vibrant urban core that caters to diverse interests and needs, San Diego's downtown is not just preserving its tourism industry, it's propelling it towards the heights of success. As California leaders look to the future, the continued revitalization and development of a city's downtown core is crucial to those looking to tourism playing an important part of their success as a tourism destination. Thank you very much.

Thank you. I have to say, if I wasn't sold on San Diego before, I am now. I already admitted you had the best tacos, but I'm not willing to admit you have the best ballpark. Not yet. We'd still like to be in competition on that one, but it is very nice. Definitely a better baseball team right now. But thank you so much for laying that out and just the incredible assets that you all have and what you offer for visitors, which I know is a hugely important part of your economy as it is for many of our downtowns across the state.

I wanted to quickly ask sort of two connected questions around that. One is what does the interaction with the state look like for you in terms of tourism? We've heard some from mayors and others about really the need for our state to be a champion for our cities in aggressively competing for conventions and advertising our state. I will say, and this has been mentioned a few times, we have a big couple years coming up for our state with the World Cup, with the Olympics, with two Super Bowls, with the NBA All Star Game coming to San Francisco. The next four years are huge for us in terms of our visibility on the world stage as a state.

So wanting to know sort of is there anything that you think we can be doing as a state better to help support that work, to really promote San Diego as a destination and then connected to that, is there anything that you might share, either in terms of data or anecdotally, about how things have come back for San Diego in terms of tourism post pandemic, what does the airport numbers look like or convention center occupancy and bookings and those kind of things? Are you seeing a positive trend? Is it coming back rapidly? Is it back to where it was? Is there still a long way to go on either of those things?

Fortunately, in San Diego, we benefited and rebounded probably quicker than many destinations in the United States. And I think one of that is - one big reason of that is the downtown area, being on the waterfront, being outside, we have a lot of outside venues, and that's what a lot of people wanted to do coming back from the pandemic. So from a numbers aspects, we're almost, I would say we're flat to where we were in terms of numbers.

Revenues are up, obviously, because room rates are up, while that also brings costs that are a little bit higher to most organizations due to inflation. But we're recovering better than most, I think in looking at numbers last week we compare ourselves to five or six different kind of competing cities between Seattle on the West Coast, Seattle, Phoenix, LA, San Francisco and Anaheim. And going into the pandemic, we were right in the middle.

San Diego was, and now coming out of it, we're at the top of the heap. So, again, we benefited nicely and rebounded quickly due to the great partnership we have amazing hotels and the outdoor weather we have. The first question about what could we do from a state perspective? We're fortunate to have Caroline Beteta and the Visit California group up in Sacramento. They do a wonderful job. Julie Coker, our President and CEO, and I think a number of folks here in the city sit on the board with Caroline, and I think they do a fantastic job representing us.

I know there was hope for a sports funding mechanism that was proposed, but I think with the budget issues, it was pulled back. That fund would have helped us to compete with some of those other states, like Texas and Florida, that have some massive funds where they able to go out and bid on some of these large events like we're talking about to help support that.

But I think we all understand the impact of the budget restraints we have right now. But that's one thing that would really be beneficial to us because we don't have a lot of destinations, also have incentive funds to go out and provide their destinations. We don't in San Diego, we don't have that fund. But I know when I lived in Dallas, they had a fund that was about $17 million. It was oftentimes matched by the state to go out and basically write checks to companies and events to come.

We're very fortunate in San Diego, and I think in many cities here in California where there's a lot of demand for San Diego. From a meetings and conventions perspective, one in every four room nights of group rooms or meetings that's booked in the United States is booked in one of our destinations in California. So that speaks a lot. There is demand, so we're fortunate for that.

Yeah. And all of this is obviously connected. But one of the things that I think is so special about the downtown here is, as you said, the convention center, the hotels, the waterfront, even the airport, very close. And people don't necessarily need to drive. And if they do, they might be able to get in and out with a ride share and they can access all of the great things just being right there. And I think a lot of the things the city has done has helped to facilitate that in terms of being able to walk and being a very pedestrian and bike friendly city. Assemblymember?

Thank you so much for both of you for your insights. And I was thinking about how oftentimes we learn from one another, certainly as cities. 11 years ago I was here staying downtown, going to the Chargers game, and I'm like, I wonder if there's a public transit way to get there. And I was able to get the light rail and get that ticket on my phone. I was the Chair of our Transit Authority in Santa Clara County that following year, and in January, when I met the General Manager, I said, well, Levi Stadium is opening this year.

By the time it opens, I would like to be able to buy a ticket online and be able to do that. But that was because I had the experience here. And so we have so much to learn from one another, and I want to just focus on that aspect of transit and transportation because I've had other experiences with my last year as Chair - or my last month, actually, there was something, a bus called the Hotel 22 because a lot of our unhoused used to sleep on.

It was a 24 hours bus. And what I learned, it went from East San Jose to Palo Alto. Palo Alto is a much higher scale, upscale community. At 3:00 - 4:00 in the morning, when I'm on that bus going back from Palo Alto to East San Jose, a lot of the workers are on that bus heading back home after a long shift at the restaurant, what have you, at the bar. And so you mentioned, Mister Johnson, about kind of the low income riders using your services. Because other than maybe much of San Francisco or some places, most of the time it's not about last miles, it's the last miles.

And so even if you want to use transit to come into your work or come to an entertainment venue in downtown, you may be many miles away to get there. And so that on demand aspect becomes a part of it. I know that a lot of transit authorities are starting to use on demand, mostly focus on what was previously paratransit and what have you, things of that nature, but not necessarily as a regular mode of usage.

And so when I think about kind of in the Bay Area, we call it seamless Bay Area. That's a goal to get to where you can go from a bus to a light rail to Bart and not think about it. My starting point is my home, my end destination is a ballpark. And just click a button and everything, all your tickets, everything is accessed that way. How do we get to that place?

Whether it's using public transit on demand, but do it in a way that's seamless, so that the worker or the family that was coming to a ballgame downtown that might live 20 minutes away can do it without having to bring their car into downtown and add to that congestion. Especially given the fact from our first presenters talking about, we want to add tens of thousands of people living downtown, we're already going to have that increased congestion. What are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, so right now we do a lot of that on our own where we partner with certain employers to, you know, if there's late night shifts or anything like that, we give subsidized rides to these employers so that these workers could not have to ride the bus or wait at a bus stop at three in the morning. They could get into a Lyft and get home safely. And then there's also partnerships with big venues like Levi's and Chase Center and places like that where obviously we have pickup and drop off areas where it's easy to get dropped off at the stadium and get picked up at the stadium.

But I think we need a little bit more help. I think we need just a recognition that Lyft and Uber are ubiquitous with transit now. And our goal was never to replace public transit. It was only to be an addition to. So you talked about first mile, last miles as it is in the Bay Area, right. I think it takes a recognition of that and us kind of seeing it all as one system, seeing it as one ecosystem. And so when we're planning for these big events, if there's any type of planning going on at the state level.

I know when it comes to the World Cup and Super Bowl in the Bay Area, they have the Bay Area Host Committee. I think LA has its own Sports Commission. I'm not sure what San Diego has, but kind of getting those organizations together and planning early and thinking about how rideshare can be a part of that before, you know, not immediately, right before the event happens, but well in advance. And I think if we can do that, if we can think about things like commuter tax benefits when it comes to including rideshare in those benefits, which is not included in right now, that's something to think about as well.

Well, I want to thank both of you for your time and your leadership. And, you know, this is absolutely a critical, both of your perspectives are critical as we think about economic recovery, and it's the people who live there and work there, but it's also the people who are visiting, and so much of our economy benefits from these kind of opportunities to bring people here in our downtowns as they change.

I think tourism is going to be even more important to our downtowns. They're less, these sort of bigger office buildings and more destinations for people who live in the region or even live far beyond for a whole variety of reasons, and for people who hopefully more and more live there themselves. So really want to appreciate both of you for being here and for your leadership and look forward to continuing to work together and for being a champion for San Diego as well.

This really is a great place, and you have a lot to offer, and we need to be sharing that because we all benefit when people come to visit San Diego and experience it, and it sort of has ripple effects through our entire state. Thank you for your time. Appreciate it. All right, well, thank you, everyone, for bearing with us. I know we went a bit over, but we had a lot to cover and really appreciate all of our panelists.

I'm now going to open it up. If there is any public comment. We have the opportunity for members of the public to provide public comment. If there is anybody, we have a mic over there. If you'll please state your name, your organization, and a brief statement on the issue. And I will open that up now. Is that on?

I think so. Chair Haney, Members of the Committee, thank you. My name is Josh Callery-Coyne. I'm a member of the Downtown San Diego Partnership and also a Board Member with the California Downtown Association. On behalf of our over 300 embers, thank you for championing our urban centers and for your passion, and we look forward to continuing the discussion today. Josh Callery-Coyne

Thank you. And thank you for being here.

Hi. Good afternoon. Chair Haney, Assemblymember, everybody here today. My name is Justine Murray. I'm the Executive Director of Public Affairs for the San Diego Regional Chamber of Commerce. We're proud to be the largest local chamber on the West Coast. We represent over 2,200 members and over 300,000 jobs across our binational region. The vitality of downtown is essential to seeing our mission through, and our mission is to make the San Diego region the best place to live and work.

We thank you for your leadership in serving on the Select Committee and your support for promoting policies and strategic efforts that encourage economic growth in these urban hubs and downtowns across our state. We thank the Downtown San Diego Partnership also for their continued efforts. And the chamber stands ready to work with our regional and state partners to ensure San Diego's downtown does not continue to thrive, but flourishes and reaches its full potential. Thank you so much for coming down.

Anyone else with public comment?

Hi. Good afternoon. I'm Joyce Liu, the Director of Sales and Catering at the Westgate Hotel and also on the City Center Business Improvement District Board as well. So, you know, getting that firsthand right in downtown and also living in downtown for the past 10 years with no car. So having the full scope of the pre pandemic, during pandemic and post pandemic recovery, it's all fine and dandy with seeing these data points of recovery and all the conventions we depend on.

These conventions, but we also have to look at those holes, the gaps between sporting events and conventions, any music events as well, because that's when. When there's nobody around to really see the homeless, that's when they are here. And that's when we need the support to really support them. But also highlight the streets, the weekends, when businesses are out of downtown and dark. That's where, you know, the perception of safety. We have transportation, MTS.

It's so easy to use the pronto card for the Coaster, the bus system, the trolley system, but the perception of coming downtown for safety reasons needs to be overcome when there's those dark gaps between events and business open hours. But it's the partnership. Everyone is really doing an amazing job, and thank you for all the funding and support, but I think that's the gap to fill. Thank you.

Thank you for that. Anyone else with public comment? Seeing none, I'm going to close our public comment. I really want to thank everyone who's participated in today's hearing, all of my colleagues who are here, Assemblymember Kalra, who's a Member of the Committee and came here from San Jose. I want to thank the mayor, and he was incredibly generous with his time. And a special thank you also to Betsy Brennan and the entire staff of the San Diego downtown Partnership. I want to thank my staff, Annie Keys, who was very instrumental in putting this entire hearing together. Fundamentally, this is about people.

It's about the people who live, work, and visit downtown, whether that's downtown San Diego, downtown San Francisco, downtown San Jose. Our city, our state, needs to be in the business of supporting the well being and ability of all of our people to thrive. And downtowns are absolutely essential to that. And one group of folks who I think we all need to thank are all of the people who make this downtown able to operate and thrive on a daily basis.

Everyone who works at all of these venues, who work at the hotels, janitors, our waiters and waitresses, our servers, our bartenders, our people who operate this business or this venue. I want to thank everyone from the Balboa Theater who's here, who's working today and helping us make this happen, and everybody who's here operating our AV and making sure we can share everything that we are doing.

All of this is about how we make sure that this place can thrive for people, and that has to always include the people who live here and also work here and make everything that we're discussing today possible. So thank you all for sticking with us. Thank you also, I know, there are some folks from legislative offices and the mayor's office who are here, and I want to thank them as well for their partnership.

We clearly have a lot of work to do, but thankfully, because of the example of San Diego and other cities in our state, we have a lot of opportunity and we have a lot to build from and we have a lot to learn. And so our Committee is going to continue to explore these issues across the state and take this information that we've gained here today back and to pursue an aggressive, proactive, creative policy agenda to be able to support our downtown recovery across the state. Thank you so much, everyone, for being here. Thank you for your time. This meeting is adjourned.