Senate Standing Committee on Public Safety

All right. The Senate Committee on Public Safety will come to order. Good morning to the Senate. Continue to welcome public in person via teleconference service. For individuals wishing to provide public comment, today's participant number is 877-226-8163 and the access code is 694-8930. We are holding our Committee hearings in Room 2200 in the O Street Building. I ask all Members of the Committee be present so we can establish our quorum and begin our hearing.

Today we will actually start as a subcommitee as we are waiting for other Members. I also do want to announce that I will also be presenting a couple of bills today, so I will be stepping out of this and having another Member chair the meeting. So we have 27 bills on today's agenda, 8 are on consent. And before we hear... Yes, we don't. I guess our first bill will be presented by Senator Portantino. Senator Portantino, you will be presenting SB 596. You have the floor.

Thank you, Madam Chair and Members. Today I'm presenting SB 596, which would expand current teacher protections to make it a misdemeanor to threaten or harass a school employee for reasons related to the course of their duties. And that's important. We're talking about people who are complying with state law during the regular course of their duties being harassed and intimidated and threatened after school time in their private lives. And that's key. When you're on campus, there's protections.

When you're off campus, you should not be harassed, intimidated, and threatened for doing your job. And in this case, we had a local teacher who was teaching about inclusion and LGBT history in accordance with state law who was harassed and threatened after school hours. And so local teachers came to me and said, please help. And that's why we're here. And if you think these issues aren't germane to California.

Just last week, at a school board meeting in my district, somebody was holding up a sign with a swastika in support of this type of harassment against teachers. And so I respectfully ask for an aye vote. We have a number of folks who I believe who will be testifying in support. Hopefully they have made it. And some folks online who are doing their duty as teachers who want to weigh in with their me too testimony. So, when appropriate, would respectfully ask for an aye vote.

Thank you. Do we have a lead witness here?

I think she's in line outside, but we'll go forward.

Okay. Do we have any other lead witnesses? Any lead opposition? All right, Senator, I apologize. We'll have the lead opposition, speak and then move forward. You will have two minutes and you will be timed. If you can come approach this, right under the mic. 1 second. Are going to call roll to establish a quorum.

[Roll Call]

Thank you. You may begin.

Thank you. Good morning. My name is Allie Snyder. I'm a mother. If SB 596 passes, it will codify a violation of our rights already in practice in some districts. Last Thursday, I directed comments to a trustee during our school board meeting, comments which could see me fined and imprisoned under this unjust bill. This is what I said verbatim. Trustee Moon, you vowed to uphold our constitution when you were sworn into office.

Two weeks ago in these chambers, you violated your oath with a deliberate attempt to suppress democratic speech. I quote you. We will not stand for anyone not supporting our trans children, not supporting our LGBTQ community, and it is not a right. If you have an issue as an individual, keep it to yourself and your family. End quote.

Ms. Moon, it is not your right to silence parents. It is not your right to impose your ideology on the families in this district. Your attempt was a violation of our first amendment. Further, your hypocrisy is staggering.

You say we must keep our concerns to ourselves and our families while you support an organization that encourages children to keep secrets from their families, an organization that says parents who don't share your beliefs are a danger to their children, and an organization that tells kids their bodies might be wrong and should be medicalized if they don't fit outdated stereotypes. Your characterization of us is dishonest and irresponsible. None of us support hatred or exclusion of any child. We are anti-child sterilization, anti-child mutilation.

We are anti-homophobia. Anyone labeling those positions as hateful needs to take a long look in the mirror. Trustee Moon, you owe our district an apology. If you cannot uphold your oath of office, you should be recalled. Thank you. Senators, I have no doubt our trustee found my comments annoying and emotionally distressing. That does not justify violating my right to say them. I oppose SB 596. Thank you.

Thank you. Next speaker, you have two minutes as well.

I am Erin Friday, the co-lead of Our Duty. SB 596 is designed to chill speech. The first amendment is the cornerstone of our constitution. Words and emails are not violence. The definition of harassment in this bill is absurd. It includes a course of conduct that seriously alarms or annoys a person and which would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress. I am annoyed that I have to keep driving 4 hours to protect against the erosion of our First Amendment rights.

I am annoyed that schools are promoting drag shows where 12 year olds are the dancers. I am annoyed that this legislation is trying to stifle discord between schools and parents to scare them into silence with threats of monetary damage and up to one year in jail for annoying or alarming a teacher. I am seriously alarmed that this Legislature wants schools to keep secrets from parents about their children.

I am alarmed and have suffered substantial emotional distress knowing that this Legislature is passing AB 665 that permits school counselors to take away children aged 12 and older and place them in residential facilities without any claim of abuse. Assembly Member Skinner states in the declaration to SB 274, the Supreme Court in Miller versus Alabama and supported by neuroscience, has recognized that young people are different and have the hallmark features of youth such as immaturity, impetuosity, and failure to appreciate risks and consequences.

I am annoyed and seriously alarmed to the point of substantial emotional distress, that this acknowledgment about the lack of maturation of youth magically disappears when this Legislature votes on any bill about a young person's gender identity. Please vote no.

Thank you. Do we have any other opposition witnesses? Please simply state your name, your organization, and that you oppose.

Greg Burt with the California Family Council. We are opposed unless amended. Thank you.

Sophia Lorey with the California Family Council. Opposed unless amended.

Lisa Disbrow, retired teacher, founder of Informed Parents of Contra Costa County. Opposed.

Rochelle Conner, Concerned Women for America. We oppose.

Arienne Adamcikova, high school teacher, San Bruno. I oppose.

Pastor Brandon Campbell, Northern California Director of the California Capitol Connection for Baptist Churches, in opposition.

Thank you. Do we have any other opposition witnesses?

Marnie Dunsmore, San Francisco. I'm a parent of a child in San Francisco, and I'm fully aware that there are issues of harassment.

Support or opposed, ma'am?

I oppose except with amendments.

Thank you. We will go back to if our lead witness in support is here, one more time. Seeing that they are not here, we will move on to witnesses waiting to testify via teleconference. Moderator, would you prompt the first individual?

Thank you. If you are in support or opposition, please press one filed by zero at this time. One filed by zero. And we will go to line 70. Madam Chair, could you please reiterate the bill we are on? I missed that.

We are on SB 596, Senator Portantino.

Thank you. So, SB 596. If you're in support or opposition, please press 1-0 at this time. And line 70, please go ahead.

Hello. Sarah Morrison, Glendale Unified School District. I am in support of SB 596.

Our next participant. Our next participant is line 133. You are open.

Hi. I oppose this bill. I'm a parent in Livermore. Thank you.

Line 115, please go ahead.

This is Toni Trigueiro on behalf of the California Teachers Association in support of SB 59. Thank you.

Line 47, please go ahead.

Good morning. Mary Little, school board trustee. I strongly oppose.

Line 136, you are open.

It's Rachel Kattan with Natomas USD for Freedom, and I oppose.

Line 86, please go ahead.

Hello, my name is Orlean Koehle, and I am a former teacher. I represent Eagle Forum of California. We are strongly opposed.

Line 37, please go ahead.

Yes. Shane, parent, San Diego, I'm opposed.

Line 23, you are open.

Hello? Can you hear me?

We can.

Lilia Dardon, Fairfield-Suisun Unified School District, retired special education teacher. I am opposed.

Line 82, you are open.

This is David Holt with Church Without Walls, and we strongly oppose.

Line 18, please go ahead.

My name is Leslie Al. I'm with the Community Impact Team, and we strongly oppose.

Line 116, please go ahead. 116, please go ahead. One more shot. Line 116, your line is open. We'll move along to line...

Concerned Women for America, and I strongly oppose.

Thank you. Line 110.

This is LaNeice Kersten, Bakersfield, California. I oppose.

Line 63, you are up.

Peggy Fava, school board trustee, Pleasant Ridge Union School District. I strongly oppose.

Line 11, please go ahead.

How do you know which is your line?

That's you. You're open, line 11.

Hello?

Please go ahead.

Monica Karalis. I am from Glendale Unified School District. I have students in the school, and I support this bill.

Line 101, please go ahead. Line 101, we missed some of that. 101, please restate.

Sorry. Phil Allora from Burbank District. I strongly oppose bill SB 596.

Moving along to line 60. You are open.

Good morning. This is Vicky Hernandez. I'm calling from Pomona, California, in strong opposition of SB 596.

Line 141, please go ahead.

Good morning. Kasia Williams calling on behalf of California Parents Union in opposition to SB 596. Thank you.

Line 124, you are open.

Yes. Julia, public school teacher. I strongly oppose.

We'll give a final reminder, please press one followed by zero if you are in support or opposition to SB 596. Line 53, please go ahead.

Carolina Caprarelli, parent at Castaic Union School District. I oppose.

Line 95, please go ahead.

Good morning. My name is Laura Dorsey. Suisun resident, parent. I strongly oppose.

Line 130, you are open.

Penny Harrington, San Diego County, opposed unless amended.

Line 144, please go ahead.

Patrick Davarhanian, social science teacher, Glendale Teachers Association board member, strongly support SB 596.

You are open line 42.

Erin Strange, Fresno. I strongly oppose.

Madam Chair, we have exhausted the queue. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm Senator Ochoa Bogh, and I'll be chairing the Committee moving forward. Senator Wahab, our Chair, had to step out to present a bill, so I will be moderating a little bit further until she gets back. On that end, we have a support witness.

This is our primary witness, who was stuck in the line. And so, as a courtesy, if we could take our primary witness.

Absolutely. Please, when you're ready.

Thank you very much. And good morning, Madam Chair and Members. Pamela Gibbs representing the Los Angeles County Office of Education. We are in very strong support of SB 596, which will help protect school employees when they are off of school campuses. One of the things that's most important to me as a child of an educator, I recall my mom being followed by children and parents who were expressing support and thanks for all of the work that she did.

But things have changed, and we know that some of the policies that are inclusive to help students feel safe at school are also reasons for our employees to be targeted. So that's why we are in support of SB 596. Although there are protections while employees are on school sites, it is important now to address their needs and safety when they are off of school sites. And so that's why we support the bill. For these reasons, we urge your aye vote.

Thank you. Opposition witnesses. We want to make sure we accommodate everyone.

Yes. Xong Lor with the California School Employees Association. We're in support of the bill.

Thank you.

Tiffany Mok on behalf of CFT. We're in support of the bill.

Okay, perfect. So I think we've accommodated everyone in support and opposition, both here in room 2200. Right, 2200. As well as the ones in the queue. So we'll bring it back to the dais for any comments and questions. Yes, Senator Skinner?

Yes, I will move the bill.

Thank you very much. Do we have any other comments or questions? All right, then. I will just basically state some comments that I've noted here. It's under my understanding, and would love to hear your comments, Senator Portantino, that according to my notes, it states that while the education code may not cover incidents of harassment that occur off campus on or in social media platforms, the penal code does. And that this bill is duplicative of existing law, which covers both criminal threats and harassment by means of electronic communications as one aspect. So, having worked in public safety and other forms of stalking bills and so forth.

It's my understanding we already have something in place that we have recourse over. So would love to hear your thoughts on that end. And it's my understanding also that beyond the threats, if anyone, whether on campus, off campus, during school hours, off hours, anyone that is threatened or stalked or even, and more importantly, harmed, we already have statute in place that could be held against the perpetrator. Your thoughts, sir?

So, a couple of things. The existing code was drafted in 1999 and chaptered in 1999 and hasn't been updated for new technologies. Also, we don't have specific laws that protect you if you're in the performance of your state responsibility.

And that's what's significant here, is we want to make sure that folks who are following state law, and in this case, a teacher who's teaching to the laws that we regulate, and we mandate in California to teach inclusion, to teach history accurately, to teach LGBT history according to state law. That if you do that, if you're complying with your duty as an educator and then somebody is attacking and harassing you off campus, we want to make sure that that specifically in law protects you for doing your duty.

And again, just as a human being, we don't want the dog walker to be harassed on the street. We don't want the plumber to be harassed, to be threatened, to be attacked. It's sort of common decency. That's why the opposition is sort of staggering. This is not about singling out parents.

And if I may, Madam Chair, the definition of harassment includes the course of conduct must be that which would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress and must actually cause substantial emotional distress in that person. We're talking about knowing and willful course of conduct directed at a specific person that seriously, alarms, annoys, harasses the person, and serves no legitimate person. That definition is taken from existing code. And so that's why the opposition, to me, doesn't make sense. We want people to be treated with respect and dignity, and in this case, for following state law, should not subject you to harassment.

So, having said that, because you just read the statement that you read, we already have it in statute.

But not specific to following California's laws and requirements of a teacher. And that's why this is important.

And it's my understanding that within those laws, there doesn't have to be a specific cause as to what or why it can be used against them, no matter what the issue. And I know you want to clarify the issue, but it doesn't mean that it can't be used within that definition to go against and hold someone responsible or perpetrator against.

We have lots of things in life that could be. The question is, should they be? And this is about whether this should happen and should be codified. We can respectfully disagree of whether it could be or should be. I believe it should be.

And I believe that it does already. But thank you very much, Senator Portantino. I love our discussions. So with that in mind, any other comments or questions? Madam.

Just briefly. Appreciate, Senator Portantino, your bringing it. Our school employees, regardless of what their position, have very difficult jobs, and it is not uncommon. Parents, we can get very, very emotional about circumstances regarding our children. However, those employees do not deserve to experience the level of harassment that your bill is addressing and the type of protections that you're offering are legitimate.

They are public servants doing an important job. And we, as elected officials, we're going to have to be subject to whatever harassment. That's just the role that we chose to play and accept when we run for office. However, a school employee does not. That is not their purpose. Anyway, I appreciate it, and I hope we get to a vote.

Thank you. Any additional comments or questions from the dais? Seeing none. Madam Secretary, would you call the roll? Oh, I'm sorry. Yes, please. Senator Portantino, would you like to close?

Thank you, Madam Chair. You know, I'm a public school parent. I'm a proud PTA member. There's certainly a role and a responsibility for parents to be involved in public school education. I mean, it is a public school education. But there's a difference between advocating for healthy education, healthy children, and attacking and harassing a public employee for doing their job. No one has the right to do that to anyone. And that's what this bill is seeking to address.

We are at a time in our life where it's become acceptable to cross boundaries of confrontation that 50 years ago people would never do. And we can't normalize that. We should be opening doors for people, not shutting doors in people's faces. We should be having a principled, civil discourse like you and I just engaged in, not screaming and yelling in somebody's face and threatening somebody's life because they're doing their job.

And that's unfortunate that our society has come to that point where we can't just say we need a civil discourse. But this bill doesn't infringe upon anybody's right to participate, to advocate. It just means don't threaten violently somebody for doing their job. And I respectfully ask for an aye vote.

Thank you very much, Senator Portantino. Madam Secretary, if you would please call the roll.

SB 596, the motion is do pass to Appropriations. [Roll Call]

What's the vote? So, SB 596, we're going to remain on call for absent Members at this time. I believe Senator Atkins is here. Madam pro tem, welcome to Public Safety. And I believe you have SB 519.

Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you very much for allowing me to present SB 5119 today, a bill that would bring additional transparency and accountability to our county jail, specifically around in-custody deaths. In 2020, there were over 150 in-custody deaths statewide, and while SB 519 is intended to provide oversight for the whole state, I came at this issue from a local perspective. Over a 15-year span, 185 people died in San Diego's jails, the highest rate of in-custody deaths in the state.

In 2021 alone, there were 18 deaths in San Diego jails. In 2021, members of the San Diego legislative delegation called on the state auditor to review the alarming and troubling deaths occurring in custody in San Diego. Last year, the state auditor released its report providing a series of recommendations, primarily at the local level, to prevent future deaths.

The state auditor also issued several state recommendations, one of which I, along with other San Diego delegation members, co-authored last year with Assemblymember Akilah Weber to bring health and mental health expertise to the Board of State and Community Corrections. While many recommendations have been implemented at the local level, there's still lingering questions about how we can bring more transparency and accountability to prevent any further deaths. And many local jurisdictions across the state are grappling with similar problems. So it's not just a San Diego problem.

In 2022, 18 people died in custody in Riverside County jail. In 2023, 7 people have died in Los Angeles County jail so far. It's only April. Sacramento, San Bernardino, and San Clara. Sorry, Sacramento, San Bernardino, and Santa Clara counties are under consent decrees. And actually, I've learned that there are 10 counties under consent decrees on this issue.

But local governments have limited control over the policies and procedures adopted by a sheriff's department, even though a county board of supervisors is required to approve a sheriff's department's budget. Interestingly, county boards of supervisors bear the responsibility of settling lawsuits involving in-custody jail deaths but have limited authority in requiring the sheriff's department to enact policies to reduce in-custody deaths.

For example, San Diego County, my county jail, the deaths and injuries have cost San Diego taxpayers almost $50 million in legal settlements and jury awards in just the past five years. SB 519 is intended to provide local governments and the public important information in order to help address these issues at the local level. So specifically, what SB 519 does, it does three things. It would ensure full reports of investigations relating to in-custody deaths are publicly accessible.

This is consistent with the state auditor's report. It would restore a county board of supervisors discretion to establish a local department of corrections and rehabilitation headed by an executive officer if the sheriff's department is unresponsive in addressing the problems with its county detention facilities. And it would expand the mission of the BSCC to promote the legal and safe conditions for youth inmates and staff in local detention facilities. Madam Chair, I understand that there are technical changes and recommendations from this committee staff.

I'm happy to take those as this moves into the next committee and on. But with me today to testify in support of the bill is Paul Parker. He is the executive officer at the San Diego County Citizens Law Enforcement Review Board, CLERB for short, and Julia Yoo, an attorney who's represented families who have died in custody. And with your permission, they will briefly speak.

Absolutely. We'll begin with our lead witnesses in support of SB 19.

Good morning, committee members. My name is Paul Parker, and I am the executive officer with the San Diego County Citizens Law Enforcement Review Board. We're the civilian oversight entity over at the San Diego County Sheriff's Department. We conduct independent investigations into all in-custody deaths. In 2021, there were 18. In 2022, there were 19 or 20, depending on whose statistics you cite. And so far this year, as the Senator has said, there have been three.

During our investigations, we're not provided internal affairs reports or findings and are not privy to the department's completed critical incident review board reports in which potential misconduct and policy violations are identified. The department contends that those reports are attorney-client privileged communications. Unfortunately, family members and community members are also not privy to those reports.

This lack of transparency, combined with the statutory and case law limitations placed upon civilian oversight entities in California, prohibit public discussion of these investigations and leave family members and the community members without answers to the most basic of questions. What preventative measures were undertaken by the department? What did it do well? What could it have done better? Most importantly, was the death preventable? Was anyone held responsible for it? What policy changes were implemented and what other actions were taken to prevent future deaths?

SB 519 is important because it will provide CLERB and families the information and documentation to help answer these questions. While this bill addresses issues in San Diego, as the senator said, it's important statewide to be clear, in addition to my five years of civilian oversight experience, I have over 20 years of medical examiner coroner experience here in California in the southwestern United States. Medical, legal, death, investigator, and executive roles. I've interacted with thousands of grieving family members over the last two decades.

I know for a fact that these family members are provided minimal, if any, relevant information during the investigation into any law enforcement related death. These investigations can last several months to several years. Upon the completion of the law enforcement investigations, these family members are provided limited information, oftentimes without having their specific questions answered. Many times, litigation is the only option for these family members to get any kind of answers about the circumstances surrounding the death of their loved ones.

When I trained medical examiner coroner employees over the last two decades, I always reminded them that the family member, whatever a family member is not told, they're going to fill in the blanks, oftentimes with conjecture and speculation, and oftentimes coming to incorrect conclusions. CLERB supports Senator Atkins's efforts to increase transparency around detention facility related deaths. SB 519 may not relieve the pain the families experience in the event of a death, but will certainly help solve the mysteries left unanswered and the stories left untold by the status quo. Thank you.

Thank you very much. And we have a second lead witness.

Thank you. Madam Chair and Committee Members, my name is Julia Yoo. I'm the President of the National Police Accountability Project, which is the largest civil rights attorney organization in the country. I serve on the Board of Consumer Attorneys of California, and I am a partner at Iredale and Yoo, a civil rights law firm based out of San Diego.

And in that capacity, for the last two decades, I have represented the victims and impacted family members of people who have died or been catastrophically injured in our local jails. And while San Diego may be the worst, it certainly is not alone in the violations of the most horrific, fundamental human rights. Across the state, at least 10 other counties have ongoing consent decrease, as Senator Atkins had mentioned earlier, and this is a statewide problem that requires and calls for a statewide solution.

This is why SB 519 has a broad support of civil rights organizations, reformists, community activists, and most importantly, the victims and the impacted families themselves. And as evidenced by the State Auditor's report, we're experiencing a crisis. And time for real reform has already come. While San Diego literally has a new sheriff in town, the culture of inaction, as we have seen time and time again, is pervasive. There must be seismic shift in the culture itself and proactive reform.

In order for us to address these deaths, boards of supervisors need to take matters into their own hands if sheriffs across the state are unwilling or unable to make the systemic changes. Our communities, particularly the communities of color and the disenfranchised, can wait no longer. We need answers and proactive changes, and I do believe sincerely that SB 519 will provide critical steps in addressing this crisis. Thank you so much.

Thank you very much. We're about to stop you because it was just over two minutes. Perfect. So we will now move on to witnesses here in room 2200 in support of SB 519, please.

Lesli Caldwell-Houston for the California Public Defenders Association, in support.

Elise Fandrich, from Trenton Price Consulting, on behalf of the Consumer Attorneys of California, in support and thanks the author.

Ed Little, on behalf of Californians for Safety and Justice, in support.

Brittney Barsotti, on behalf of the California News Publishers Association, California Broadcasters Association, Media Alliance, and Oakland Privacy, in support.

James King, on behalf of the Ella Baker Center, in support.

Philippe Kelly, on behalf of the Ella Baker Center, in support.

Shay Franco-Clausen, advocate and facilitator in Elmwood Correctional Facility, in full support.

Leia Schenk, community Empact community organization, in full support.

Dan Seeman, on behalf of the Anti-Recidivism Coalition, social change Insight Garden Program, and the Re-Entry Providers Association, in strong support.

Jeannette Zanipatin, on behalf of the Drug Policy Alliance, in strong support.

Forget to keep my mic on. Do we have any other support witnesses for SB 519 here in room 2200? Seeing none, we'll now move on to witnesses in opposition for SB 19. Any lead opposition witnesses here for SB 519? Seeing none, we'll now move to witnesses in opposition to SB 519 here in room 2200. Seeing none, we'll now move on to our witnesses via the teleconference service. So we will move up to both witnesses in support and opposition for SB 519. And those witnesses, please, if you would, state your name, your position and the organization that you're representing. Only moderator, if you would, please queue up the witnesses in support and opposition to SB 519 and we will continue.

Thank you. As Madam Chair stated, if you are in support or opposition to SB 519, please take this opportunity and press one followed by zero. One followed by zero. We'll begin with line 156. 156, you are open.

156 one more shot. We'll move along to line 180. Line 80, please go ahead.

Leslie Crawford, in support of representing Saving Lives in Custody in San Diego. Number 19 was my son.

Line 168, please go ahead.

It on behalf of initiate justice in strong support.

Line 169, you are open.

The white steam on behalf of Disability Rights California, and we are in support.

Line 153, you are open.

Pastor Jordan Christ First Ministry. I'm in support.

Please go ahead, line 38.

Rachel Mueller with Weitman Group on behalf of Next Gen California and Immigrant Defense Advocates in support of SB 519. Thank you.

Line 41, please go ahead.

This is Mali Woods-Drake with Encinitas 4 Equality in strong support. Thank you.

You are open. Line 39.

Yusef Miller, North County Equity and Justice Coalition and Saving Lives in Custody campaign in San Diego in strong support.

Line 23, please go ahead, and we'll give one final reminder. Please press one, followed by zero. If you're in support or opposition to SB 519, please go ahead. 23.

Lilia Dardone, in strong support based on actual things that my son witnessed while he was in custody in Riverside County.

And we will go to line 171, please go ahead.

Hi, I'm Denise Settles with the Saving Lives in Custody campaign, and I am in support of SB 519. We need to save and protect these dishonorable populations. Thank you.

Line 69, you are open.

Hi, Cheryl Canston from San Diego with Moms Against Torture, in strong support of SB 519.

Line 166, please go ahead.

Tom Packard, Showing Up for Racial Justice, North County, San Diego, in support.

And Madam Chair, there are no other participants queued up for public comment.

All right, thank you very much, Mr. Moderator, and thank you for the reminder call to our witnesses to queue up. We'll now bring it back to our Committee Members. Senator Skinner.

Thank you, Madam Vice Chair. I greatly appreciate you bringing this bill. One of my county's jail is in a similar circumstance. It's been under investigation by the Department of Justice. Even under the Trump administration. I think at one point we were the ones with the highest number of deaths per jail per capita.

I mean, not that I feel that it's good that anybody surpassed us, but the conditions were horrific, and they've been investigated not only for the deaths, but for the treatment of mentally ill inmates, and many, many other things. And, of course, every time, community members, the sheriff has not been responsive. In fact, it led to the sheriff losing their reelection. And when the community members approach the Board of Supervisors, nothing we can do.

And while I have never interpreted our state laws in such that there was nothing a Board of Supervisors could do, because, for example, the inspection of jail facilities is in law in the hands of county Boards of Supervisors, as well as the provision of health care. However, we still have the circumstance where the counties up and down the state all act like there's nothing we can do. So that is why this bill is so needed.

Now, I will also speak to BSCC, which has not been addressed by the public comment so far, and that is the Board of State and Community Corrections, which was created when the state did the realignment that resulted in our county jails having so many more people in them than previously.

And the BSCC was given, as the LAO report that is cited in the analysis has referenced, some very vague, I'll call it vague, maybe when we adopted the statute, we didn't think so, but some non-fully defined responsibilities. Which the result is that the BSCC, while they have some responsibilities for oversight of the jails and they were created, could create some level of accountability for the fact that we did the realignment increased.

There has been no change in any jail conditions as a result of the BSCC existing. And in the years that I was Chair of the Public Safety Budget Subcommittee, after many, many hearings, and my conclusion was there's no purpose for the BSCC. So it is important and good that your bill is adding some more specific purpose.

I would probably go further, but maybe we can over time, because if we create something called the Board of State and Community Corrections and we tell the public its responsibility is to hold, to make sure that our conditions in our jails are something that people would not be embarrassed by, then it needs to have the teeth to do that. So you're adding some, this bill, rather SB. I'm sorry, I'm forgetting that 519, add some, which is good.

And additionally, I think it's very important that the parts of your bill that allow for more public disclosure, because sunshine is the best disinfectant, and the fact that advocates and families could not get any information about circumstances of their loved ones who died in the facility or who had psychotic breakdowns and such, or who, we later learned, perhaps, were constrained in cells for days at a time. So that part of your bill is also really important and really needed.

So I very much appreciate you bringing it. I would love to, if you're willing, be added as a co-author, and I'm sure there's other people who want to speak, but I will also move the bill.

Thank you.

Thank you. Senator Skinner, do we have any other comments or questions from the dais okay. Yes, it has been moved. So it's my understanding that my counties or county is still working with your office. And I look forward to seeing. I actually appreciate many of the points that you're trying to address, because we have had some incidents in our county as well. So I appreciate the effort and the intent of the bill for transparency.

I'm always about transparency and accountability, especially when it comes to our agencies and entities here in the state. And I've been an advocate for that. I'm going to lay off the bill right now, as is in hopes that the concerns are addressed. But I am in support of the intent of the bill to have transparency and have our families know what happened to their loved ones under our custody. So on that I will lay off. Any other comments?

Nope. Are we good? Okay. So, Senator Atkins, would you like to close, please?

Thank you, Madam Chair. Let me thank all of the speakers today that were here to speak in support of the bill and those that called in. I greatly appreciate your showing up for this. I want to acknowledge my colleague, Ms. Skinner from Berkeley, because the transparency piece actually builds off of two of her previous bills to try to do this. And lastly, I would say to you, Madam Chair, and to everyone, we have work to do here. This is not about pointing fingers.

This is about, we have a responsibility to provide the oversight, the transparency, and the resources. And if you talk to any of the sheriffs, one of the things they're going to bring up is that we don't provide enough resources or they're not enough there to support some of these mechanisms we need to put in place to provide the safety in our jails. And so this allows some local control for a Board of Supervisors to make the determination to set up their own department.

The transparency piece is really critical. And to your point about BSCC, we've had conversations. The Chair of this committee and I sit on rules, and we have talked to some of those comfortees about what our concerns are. So I just want to make sure we realize we all have some responsibility here. It isn't just that this bill will solve a problem, not if we don't follow through and provide the kinds of supports we need to from everyone engaged in this.

So I am still working with people, I have met with individuals from law enforcement to hear their recommendations. I'll continue to work with them. But in the meantime, I just really think that this is so important for us to understand and hear what's going on statewide and do our job to make sure we're providing that kind of safety I ask for your support and thank you for your time.

Thank you, Senator Atkins. Madam Secretary, if you would please call the role.

SB 519. The motion is do passed to governance and finance.

[Roll Call]

Okay, we'll remain. We'll leave this bill on call for our absent members, and we will now continue with Senator Grove. Welcome, Senator Grove. We are going to be privy to your SB 14. When you're ready, please.

Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. Good morning, Chair and Members. Before I begin, I'd like to thank the Chair and this Committee staff for their assistance on this Bill. Although it's my belief that trafficking an individual of any age, for any purpose should be considered a serious felony, in order to move this Bill forward today, I'll be accepting the Committee amendment outlined in the analysis.

Senate Bill 14 is a bipartisan measure that is joint-authored by Senator Caballero and Senator Rubio and co-authored by 10 Senators and 19 Assembly Members. Our Bill will include human trafficking of a list of crimes that's defined serious under California law, making it a strikeable offense. As we all know, human trafficking is exploding in our cities across the country. This horrendous practice could very easily be defined as the crime of our time.

The buying and selling of people for financial gain is a brutal crime that uses mental, physical, and psychological manipulation and violence to control their victims. With the proliferation of social media and easy access to victims, no one is safe from the far reachers of the human trafficker's grip. Men, women, and children of all ages are lured and forced into both sex and labor trafficking. And unfortunately, California is one of the largest hubs of human trafficking.

Data from the service providers of the U.S. National Human Trafficking Hotline has consistently shown that groups who experience marginalization by race, income, gender and sexual identity and orientation, and immigration status are more likely to be exploited through sex and labor trafficking. I want to take a moment and thank Senator Bradford from Gardena for highlighting this fact with his Ebony Alert, which is a Bill that outlines Bow black women and girls are increased risk of being harmed and trafficked, and are disproportionately missing in California.

Data from the 2019 United States census shows that people who are Black and African American make up nearly 13.4% of the United States population. However, nearly 40% of the persons of people of color, Black children, make up about 38% of the missing child cases. Senator Bradford's information on his data sheet for his Ebony Alert provided us with that immensely important factual information to support our sex trafficking Bill. Thank you for your work, Senator.

The Congressional Black Caucus Foundation report on human trafficking found in every two years a study of human trafficking incidents across this country, 40% of sex trafficking victims were identified as Black women. According to the FBI, 53% of all juvenile prostitution arrests were Black children. There is no such thing as juvenile prostitution. This sex trafficking as juveniles cannot consent to sex. Again, I'd like to thank Senator Bradford for providing these harrowing statistics.

Additionally, Native American women and girls are victims of human trafficking at a much higher rate compared to the overall population. California has the 6th highest death rate in indigenous women in urban cities. Due to the pervasive nature of this issue, here in the Golden State, California was chosen to be the first pilot program location for the United States Department of Justice in Missing, Murdered, and Indigenous Persons Initiative.

Again, that's why trafficking a person of any age, from one to death, for any reason, including both labor and sexual exploitation, should be considered a serious felony. Exploitation of our most vulnerable populations should be treated as a serious crime that it is. In order to confront the crisis human trafficking, of human trafficking, a holistic approach needs to be addressed on every facet of this complex issue, including education, identification, funding, and direct support for services for survivors and trauma-informed care.

However, we also need stiffer penalties for consequences for traffickers themselves, who are perpetrating these brutal and heinous acts on our most vulnerable, especially those that traffic children. Human trafficking victims face a brutal reality many of us cannot even fathom. Traffickers control every aspect of their victims' lives and treat them as modern slaves. Victims are forced to work 365 days a year without pay. The trafficker tells them when to work, when to eat, when to sleep, and when to rest.

And they take every dollar that they earn. Traffickers even brand their victims in order to show ownership over them as property. Some teenage girls, as young as 12, are forced to wear a tattoo brand on their face forever. They're forced to wear this tattoo because they no longer have their life as their own. They're controlled and owned by another person. They very rarely, if not at all, call them by their name. They call them something completely inappropriate to mention in this Committee.

The violence and torture endured by these victims is so gruesome, it's difficult to understand. Violent acts such as rape, sodomy, beatings, strangulation, are often endured, sometimes on a daily basis. These traffickers are repeat offenders who are preying on our children. One example of trafficking from my district is Cavan Richardson. He trafficked a 15-year-old girl from Orange County in 2017, was sentenced to eight years in prison, and got out after serving less than four. As soon as he got out, he targeted children again.

He was arrested and prosecuted for simultaneously commercially exploiting adults and three minors, and his victims ranged from ages from 14 to 20. Colleagues, I hope that we can all agree here today that repeatedly selling children for sex, forcing them to be raped over and over again, should be considered a serious felony in the State of California. Passing SB 14 would serve to protect future generations by stopping people from engaging in this crime today.

SB 14 has received over 70 support letters from human trafficking nonprofits, district attorneys, and community organizations from tribal communities such as the Tule River Tribe, and organizations such as Veterans for Child Rescue.

National organizations that note that SB 14 include the Center of Missing and Exploited Children, founded by John Walsh, the National Center for Sexual Exploitation, Crimes Evicted United Alliance for Families against Violence and Sexual Assault, and Children's Advocacy Centers of California, as well as Women to Women, which is an organization that supports formerly incarcerated women. And late last night, we received a letter from the California Faculty Association representing 29,000 members in the State of California supporting this Bill.

In addition, my office has received over 1,300 individual letters of support from everyday Californians that want to see human trafficking of a child properly classified as a serious felony. I'm honored to have 3 Strands Global Foundation as a sponsor of SB 14 today. Three Strands fights every day to end the horrendous practice of human trafficking and protect survivors of this horrific crime. Californians from across this state have shared their personal stories and voiced their support of SB 14.

But here with me to testify directly are two experts in the human trafficking field. My first witness is in human trafficking world is former Alameda County District Attorney, Nancy O'Malley. Former District Attorney in O'Malley's office has prosecuted more than 800 human trafficking cases, the majority of which have involved minor female victims. DA O'Malley is the founder of the Human Exploitation and Trafficking Institute, otherwise known as HEAT.

Additionally, to shine a light on this issue with the first-hand knowledge, my second witness is an incredible advocate and human trafficking survivor, Ms. Brianna Williams. Ms. Williams was not only trafficked as a child, but she also lost her beautiful sister to trafficking as well. The O'Malley.

Thank you and good morning. I have recently retired as the District Attorney, but I'm still involved in the work combating human trafficking. Human trafficking occurs when there is involuntary servitude, or what we now commonly call modern-day trafficking or slavery. Those are terms used by President Obama and President Biden when they declared January Human Trafficking Awareness Month.

In my 39-year career, I know that human trafficking is one of the most destructive crimes that exist in this world, destructive to the psyche and for sure, to the bodies of sex trafficking victims. While all 50 states have now reported human trafficking, California and particularly the Bay Area, Los Angeles and San Diego are hotspots, according to the FBI statistics. We see victims being brought here from Los Angeles, primarily to Oakland. They're between the ages of 15 and 21. They don't know what city they're in.

They don't have a recourse to get away from the trafficker. Research shows us that the percentage of trafficked victims, the higher percentage are people of color. And particularly in the Bay Area, Los Angeles, and San Diego, according to the statistics, the highest percentage of trafficked victims are African American girls. Research also shows that the high percentage of women and some men are brought here from other countries with a promise of a job.

But when they get here, they're immediately put into servitude and are forced to either work in labor without pay, or they are forced into the human trafficking, sex trafficking. We're now looking closely, research through the HEAT Institute and other bodies of research, looking at the high incidence of disappearance of First Nation or Native American girls who are disappearing at an alarming rate to indicate whether or not they are linked to human trafficking. We believe it's true.

According to the San Diego study, they identified a minimum of almost 2,000 victims of human trafficking in one year in San Diego County. And the average age of entry for those individuals was 14 to 15 years old. The study also found that the underground sex economy, the human trafficking, is an estimated $810,000,000 in annual revenue. In the 26 years since I've been working on this issue, as Senator Grove said, I have either prosecuted or supervised prosecution of now 850 human trafficking cases.

There's a commonality amongst traffickers, and this is important for the request that human trafficking be identified as a serious felony under California law. The commonality is that the act involves severe psychological manipulation. There is intense physical abuse. There is torture used by traffickers to gain compliance of the victim. Oftentimes, what we've seen is that there have been men brought in to gang rape the victim to get her into compliance. Before that, she's put out on the street or on the Internet.

Traffickers generally remove their victims from a place of familiarity. So even if they wanted to escape, they could not, just as we've seen in Oakland. Generally speaking, traffickers have a lack of care or compassion, or concern for the victims and are using them solely for financial gain. Human trafficking is one of the most egregious crimes inflicted on the most vulnerable victims in our society, and I urge you to vote yes on this Bill. Thank you.

Thank you so much. You were just around the two minute mark, so I appreciate your time. Now we're here for Ms. Williams.

Good morning. My name is Brianna Williams. I'm a survivor of human trafficking here in Sacramento County. I stand here today to express my unwavering support for SB 14. This Bill is not just a piece of legislation. It's a beacon of hope for those that have been victimized by human trafficking. It is a testament to our collective commitment to protect and empower the most vulnerable members of our society. During my childhood as a teen, as a young teen, I was trafficked throughout California.

I was beaten and brutalized by my trafficker on a daily basis and suffered unimaginable physical and emotional trauma. After my escape, I did not give up. I fought back with all my might, and with the help of several people, including my mom, and organizations like Love Never Fails, I managed to escape the clutches of my tormentor. I am now the owner of two businesses, and my life's mission is to advocate for others.

My story is a testament to resilience of the human spirit, but is also a stark reminder of the horrors of sex trafficking. We cannot turn a blind eye to the scourge that plagues this society. We must take action to prevent it from happening time and time again by the same perpetrators. Yesterday was also the one-year anniversary of the tragic death of my little sister that has shaken my family to its core. And this is my little sister.

My 23-year-old little sister, Blair Mosley, was also sex trafficked, and it caused her to have a mental break after traffickers, after her trafficker and others brutally raped her. She returned to a childlike state and on April 24, 2022, she had knownly walked into I-5 highway here in Sacramento and was struck and killed by a car. Blair was one of the most amazing people I know. She had dreams to become an attorney and open a restoration home for the unhoused.

This tragedy is a stark reminder that the devastating impact of sex trafficking can have on individuals and families. It is a reminder that we cannot afford to be complacent. We must do everything in our power to prevent such tragedies from happening again. So I urge you to support SB 14. Let us send a clear message that we will not tolerate sex trafficking in our state.

Let us stand together in solidarity with those who have been victimized and let us work together for a brighter, safer future for all. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Ms. Williams. We'll now move on to witnesses in support of SB 14 here in Room 2200, please.

Ashlie Bryant, CEO, 3 Strands Global Foundation, in support.

Odessa Perkins, in support of SB 14. I stood before you guys last year as the witness, letting you know that I am also a survivor of human trafficking. My mother trafficked me, so this crime affects everyone. We have to pass SB 14 in order for our children to be safe.

Thank you.

I'm Jenna McKaye with Senator Grove's office, and I'm also a survivor of human trafficking and still deal with the trauma that was put on me physically and mentally. And I support SB 14. Thank you.

Thank you.

Madam Chair and Members, Randy Perry, on behalf of PORAC and the Highway Patrol Association, in support of the Bill.

Thank you.

My name is Arlene Espinosa. I'm a licensed marriage and family therapist with ZOE International, and I strongly support SB 14.

Thank you.

Hi. Good morning, and thank you. I was here last year also, too. I'm a parent whose child was trafficked, and I work with parents, and every day I see children. I have seen a child who committed suicide because her trafficker continued to follow her. Another child was taken from someone. A trafficker went into the house in front of her mother and took her out.

I'm sorry.

Thank you for your time. I honor you and I bless. And you guys are servants of the Lord. May justice be done. Thank you.

Let me just remind everyone that at this time, we're going to be taking witnesses in support of SB 14. But it's the me too. So it's just your name, your position, and the organization that you're representing. Please. Thank you.

Good morning. Cindy De Silva, I'm a Deputy District Attorney for the California District Attorneys Association, in support.

Thank you.

Chair and Members, Jonathan Feldman, with the California Police Chiefs Association, in support.

Thank you.

Good morning. Aretha Perkins. I'm a registered voter for the State of California. It's about people, not politics. I support SB 14. Thank you.

Thank you, ma'am.

My name is Faith Heath with Helping Us, an anti-human trafficking organization, and I am in support.

Thank you.

My name is Laura Phillips, and I'm with the Jenna Mckay Foundation. I strongly support this Bill.

Thank you.

Marjorie Saylor, survivor of human trafficking from San Diego County, Director of Client Services at Alabaster Jar Project, and I support the Bill.

Thank you.

Pamela Lopez, on behalf of the Tule River tribe, in support.

Thank you.

Leah Shang, Impact community organization Also representing Project Take in strong support of 14. Thank you.

Shay Franco-Clausen, Alameda County, Oakland resident, and I'm supportive of this as a survivor of sex trafficking.

Thank you.

Arian Adam Chakova, San Francisco resident, friend of two mothers of a daughter who was sexually trafficked out of her home in San Francisco, also a high school teacher of marginalized, sexually trafficked young students, and I support 14.

My name is Joel. I'm from Fairfield, California. I'm in strong support of SB 14.

Thank you.

I'm Joan Pavarnick. I'm from Fairfield, California, by way of San Francisco. I'm representing Loving Through His Eyes nonprofit for sex trafficking girls, and I'm in support of SB 14.

Thank you.

Good morning, Madam Chair and Members. Cory Salzillo, on behalf of the California State Sheriffs Association, in support.

Thank you.

Good morning. Lisa Disbrow, Informed Parents of Contra Costa County and Calvary Chapel, Chino Hill in support.

Thank you.

Good morning. Emily Sanders, survivor, founder, and Executive Director of Connected Change in support of SB 14.

Thank you.

Good morning. My name is Mariam Nujam. I'm a legal immigrant from Egypt, where human trafficking is a business. It's about time to make it a felony. Thank you, Senate.

Thank you.

Izzy Swindler with Shaw Yoder Antwih Schmelzer and Lange, on behalf of Supervisor Micare and Supervisor Townsend from Tulare County, as well as the Board of Supervisors in Kern, the Board of Supervisors in Fresno, in support. Thank you.

Thank you.

Hi, I'm Dr. Angela Look. I work for Child Protective Services in Kern County, in strong support of this Bill.

Hello. Katrina Garcia, the Human Trafficking Liaison for Kern County Probation Department, in strong support of Senate Bill 14.

Thank you.

Erin Friday of Our Duty, licensed attorney, in support.

Thank you.

Allie Snyder, concerned parent, in support.

Thank you.

Rochelle Connor, Concerned Women for America, strong support.

Thank you.

Sophia Lori, with Young Women for America as well as approached by sex traffickers while I was in college in Orange County, in strong support.

Thank you.

Greg Burr, with the California Family Council, in strong support.

Thank you.

Todd Riebe, Amador County District Attorney, strong support.

Thank you.

Pastor Brandon Campbell, Faith Baptist Church in Wheatland in Northern California, Director of the California Capital Connection in support.

Thank you.

Scott Dean, pastor of Elmira Baptist Church. We strongly support SB 14.

Thank you. Do we have any other witnesses in support of SB 14 here in Room 2200? Seeing none. We will now move on to witnesses in opposition or lead witnesses in opposition for SB 14.

Good morning. Leslie Caldwell, Houston for the California Public Defenders Association. I'm asking to yield my two minutes to Sister Warriors Coalition for a total of four minutes to them.

Okay.

Thank you.

Good morning, Committee and Chair. My name is Emily Wonder, and I'm reading this statement on behalf of April Grayson, who is currently providing testimony in another Committee. April is a Policy Associate for the Sister Warriors Freedom Coalition and member of numerous anti-trafficking advisory boards for commercially sexually exploited children and adults throughout California. She is also a survivor of human trafficking, and she wrote this statement in opposition of SB 14. If SB 14 passes, human trafficking will become a strikable offense with harsher sentences and lifelong consequences.

As a survivor, April can see the positive intent of this Bill. However, as a survivor who has been criminalized and demonized by the legal system that was meant to protect her, she asked me to remind the authors and this Committee that this Bill will actively harm many survivors of human trafficking, especially the Black, brown, Native, poor, LGBTQ women, and trans survivors who are already least likely to see justice. April was born into the CPS system and has touched every system California has to offer.

After she was kicked out of the system at 18, she was trafficked. At 19, she was criminalized by the court system made out to be the perpetrator in the mastermind of a crime that she was also the victim of. She was sentenced to 20 years and eight months. At that time, the charges were pimping and pandering, but if she had been sentenced today, she would have been charged with human trafficking.

She served 17 years in state prison where she received no referral to healing or rehabilitative services. She was considered a violent felon and had to register as a sex offender. April was never seen as a victim of human trafficking. She was only seen as perpetrator, even though she was 19 and her 27-year-old trafficker was sitting next to her in court. He was never identified as a trafficker, let alone her trafficker, and was never convicted of any trafficking or pimping charges.

April is not a unique case. Not addressed in this Committee's and Bill analysis is the horrifying reality that over 90% of human trafficking victims are criminalized while being trafficked, including many who have human trafficking charges instead of their trafficker. We need to acknowledge that our criminal legal system is not equipped to recognize human trafficking victims, especially young women and trans folks of color who are victims of sexual exploitation.

Our current laws fail to provide judges and juries with the information necessary to help them identify victims, something that we're trying to fix in another Bill being heard in the Assembly today. If SB 14 passes, criminalized survivors will be subjected to punishments that will be doubled or escalated to a life sentence under three strikes, in many cases doubled, just for low-level offenses that are not serious or violent.

And prosecuting these survivors will not stop trafficking from happening, since these survivors are easily replaced by their traffickers. Even with recent amendments to this Bill, there are still many survivors who would fall through the cracks and face further punishment and trauma. Survivors like April. This Bill will have severe collateral negative consequences for victims and survivors. This is not the solution. The solution is to properly investigate cases, provide healing resources, and prevent further harm against survivors by the criminal legal system.

Until we can protect victims from arrest, we must not pass laws that will further harm them, their families, and our communities. We have to stop creating bills that don't address the nuances of the situation, or we will continue to hurt vulnerable, traumatized victims. We intimately understand how serious human trafficking is, and we recognize what Senator Grove and co-authors are trying to do with this Bill. But until we can successfully identify victims and provide them support and relief, we cannot be in support of SB 14. Thank you.

Thank you very much. So we just heard from our lead witnesses in opposition to SB 14. We'll now continue with witnesses in opposition to SB 14 here in Room 2200.

Leslie Caldwell, Houston, for the San Francisco Public Defender's Office, in opposition.

Thank you, ma'am.

Do we have any other witnesses in opposition to SB 14 here in Room 2200? Seeing none. We'll now move on to witnesses both in support and opposition via our teleconference service. As a reminder, please, all the witnesses testifying via the teleconference. You are to state your name, your position, and the organization that you're representing. Mr. Moderator, if you would please queue up the witnesses both in support and opposition to SB 14, and we will continue.

Thank you. Madam Chair. If you are in support or opposition to SB 14, please press one followed by zero at this time. One followed by zero. And we will begin with line 186. You are open. Line 186, please go ahead. I think you just took yourself out of queue. Go ahead and hit one zero again, 186, and we'll get back to you. And we'll go to 123.

Hi. Good morning, Madam Chair and Members of the Committee. Sharon Gonsalves on behalf of Mayor Karen Goh and the City of Bakersfield in strong support of SB 14. Thank you.

Line 26, please. Go ahead.

Rima Nashashibi, Vice Chair of the Democratic Party of Orange County for 10 years and President of the past president of the National Women Political Caucus of Orange County and the Newport Beach Women Democratic Club, founder, and President. I strongly support this Bill.

Line 168, you are open.

Sarah Rigney, on behalf of Initiate Justice, in respectful opposition. Thank you.

Line 119, please go ahead.

Good morning. This is Jody Ding calling on the behalf of San Diego County District Attorney Summer Stephan in support of this Bill. Thank you.

139, you are up.

Hi, my name is Hannah Rams. I'm a Los Angeles County resident, and I am strongly in support of this Bill.

Line 195, please go ahead.

Hello, my name is Yadira De Leon. I am from San Bernardino County, and I am in strong support of SB 14. Thank you.

Line 23, you are open.

Lilia Dardone, volunteer with Shepherdsgate in Contra Costa County and student of God and government, and I strongly support SB 114. I mean, sorry. SB 14.

Line 39, please go ahead. I think 39 took themselves out of queue. We'll go to line 55.

Yes, this is Monica Kovach. I'm the Chair of the Bridge of Light Anti-Human Trafficking Ministry, strongly in support.

192, you are open.

Matt Look, Arvin, California, support SB 114.

Line 37, please go ahead.

Shane, sex assault survivor and parent. I strongly support.

You are open, line 210. 210.

Dominic Heiden, Bakersfield, California, in support.

Line 206, please go ahead.

Hello? Is that me?

Please go ahead. Yes.

Good morning. Thank you. Mary Little, Kern County trustee. I urge you to support this and vote for it. Thank you.

Line 199, please go ahead.

Anne Marie Viegas, mother of four, Sacramento county resident. I strongly support SB 14. Thank you.

Line 110, you are open.

Lenny Kirsten, Bakersfield, California. I am for this amendment. I'm sorry, this Bill. Thank you.

Line 19, please go ahead.

Franks. I'm a children and family pastor in Butte County for the Church of the Nazarene, and I strongly support SB 14.

Line 82, please go ahead. Line 82, are you muted? One more shot, line 82. Moving along. Line 191, please go ahead.

Anne, County voter and I strongly. SB 14.

Line 57, please go ahead.

Good morning. My name is Amie Ichikawa. I am the founder and Executive Director of the nonprofit WomanIIWoman, and we advocate for the incarcerated. I strongly support SB 14. Thank you.

196, you are open.

Yes. My name is Melanie Bond. I'm an L.A. County resident and I'm in strong support.

Line 63, please go ahead. Line 63, are you muted? Please go ahead, line 63. We'll go to line 10. Please go ahead.

I'm Catherine Cox and I'm in support of this Bill and I'm in L.A. County.

Line 197, please go ahead.

My name is Cynthia Jamara, and I'm the coordinator for project rescue in conjunction with CityServe and Canyon Hills Assembly, and I strongly support SB 14. Thank you.

86, your line is open.

This is Orlean Koehle. I represent Eagle Forum of California. We all strongly support this Bill.

198, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Clarissa Ortega. I am an associate clinical social worker in L.A. County, and I'm in strong support of this Bill.

154, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Christian Toma, I'm a Los Angeles resident, and I strongly support SB 14.

Line 35, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is David Cox from Los Angeles, a concerned citizen and a friend of Vic, and I strongly support SB 14.

Line 98, you are open. Line 98, are you muted? Go ahead, line 98. We'll move on to line 59. Please go ahead.

Hello, my name is Destiny Jensen, I am a former sex trafficking victim and I'm from Oakland County, and I strongly support this Bill.

186, please go ahead. 186, we are back to you. Please go ahead.

Yes, hello, good morning. Can you hear me?

Yes.

I strongly support this Bill, SB 114.

Line 138, you are open.

Line 138, please go ahead. We'll try. Line 217, please go ahead.

Kelsey Mccoy, Bakersfield, California. Strong support for this Bill.

You are open. Line eight.

This is Cliff Cox. I support his Bill from LA.

Please go ahead. Line 53. Line 53, please go ahead.

Can you hear me?

Yes.

Carolina Caparelli, LA County voter, and I support this Bill.

Line 36, you are open.

Tiffany Suits, human trafficking prosecutor, in support of SB 14.

Line 218, please go ahead.

Ray Grangoff with the Orange County Sheriff's Department in support of 218 of this legislation.

Line 24, you are open.

Good morning. My name is Dr. Doug Bennett in Bakersfield, California. I'm a former buyer of human beings and an advocate of sex trafficking victims. I'm the founder of Magdalene Hope and been fighting sex trafficking for 14 years and founder of the fifth safe house to open in California in 2013. Restoration ranch women's shelter in strong support of SB 14.

Line 39, please go ahead. Line 39, you are open. Are you muted? Line 39, we'll move on to line 174, please go ahead. Line 174, please unmute. All right. Line 124, please go ahead.

Yes. Julia, inner city public school teacher. I support this.

Line 147, you are open. Line 147. Hello, you are open.

Hi, my name is Margie Garcia. I'm from El Dorado county. I'm a mental health worker and I strongly support SB 14.

Please go ahead. Line 130. Line 130, are you muted? Your line is open. We can hear you. Line 130, please go ahead. We'll try. Line 225, please go ahead.

Hi, there. Calling on behalf of Initiate Justice Action, respectfully in opposition.

We'll go ahead and give a final reminder. 1-0 if you are in support or opposition to Senate Bill 14. Line 226, please go ahead.

I'm Julie May, I'm in support of SB 14.

231, you are open.

Hi, my name is Shannon Heil, and I'm with placer county Moms for Liberty, and I support this Bill. SB 14, thank you.

Line 189, please go ahead.

Yes, this is Penny Martinez. I'm with the Bakersfield Republican Women Federated. I'm the current Caring for America program chair, and we strongly support SB 14. Thank you.

138, please go ahead.

Yes, this is Laurel Botsford, founder and Executive Director of Wisdom International and Member of the San Francisco Collaborative against Human Trafficking and the Marin County Coalition against Human Trafficking. We strongly support this Bill.

242, your line is open.

This is Kathleen Barton representing Concerned Women for America, and I strongly support SB 14.

Line 130, please go ahead. Line 130, you are open.

Penny Harrington from San Diego County strongly support.

Line 230, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Matthew Martin, representing Chairman of the Board of Supervisors in Kern, County, Jeff Flores, and strong support of SB 14.

Line 247, please go ahead. Line 247, are you muted? One more shot. Line 247, we'll go to line 250, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Jamie Aria, and I'm calling to SB 596.

Line 147, please go ahead.

Hello?

You're open.

Hi. My name is Margie Garcia from El Dorado County. I strongly support SB 14.

Line 194, please go ahead.

Hello. Good morning. Good morning. My name is Jean Skintea, and I support SB 14.

Madam Chair, we did get through the queue.

Wonderful. Thank you very much, Mr. Moderator, for your help. We want to thank all our witnesses, both in support and in opposition, that came in person and took the time to participate via our teleconference service. We will now bring the discussion back to the dais. Senator Skinner?

Thank you, madam Vice Chair. Senator, I appreciate your not only passion about this issue, but your dedication to it. And while, as a Member of the Committee, we were not supportive of the Bill in the form that you presented previously, I'm very appreciative of your accepting the amendments. And I do appreciate that you would like it to go farther.

But I think the points made by the witness in opposition, who is herself a survivor, that could, and I know it would never be intentional, but where an actual victim of trafficking could end up being prosecuted in a third strike type of circumstance around their own victimization. And I think it's only been recently that we even began to treat underage girls who were involved in commercial sex trade as the victims versus the actual criminals. It has only been recently.

And so the fact that we have accepted the fact that any person under 18 who is in commercial sex trade has absolutely been exploited, is absolutely the victim, and someone else is exploiting them. This is not a choice that they make. And so I appreciate your willingness to modify the Bill. And, again, I also appreciate you'd like to go further, but I'm willing to support it with its amendments, and with that, I would move the Bill.

Thank you. Senator Skinner, do we have any other comments or concerns from the dais? Seeing none, I just want to also thank Senator Grove for. Sorry.

I'm just very grateful for the work that you've done. But before we move on, I would like you to have the opportunity to address the concerns of the speaker in opposition, who expressed some concerns. I think I remember you had some thoughts prior to, and would love to give you that opportunity at this time.

Thank you, madam chair. In my close 20 years ago, an injustice was perpetrated against April Grayson. 20 years ago, people were not treated as victims in the sex trade organization. They were treated as criminals. Even law enforcement and district attorneys have changed their attitude about the way people were treated. I know April Grayson is not in this Committee hearing today, but I would ask you to tell her that last year, I heard her. I heard her voice, the pain in her voice.

I gave her my personal cell phone number. I removed violent from the Bill that we had last year and made it only serious so that people like April Grayson would never be prosecuted again and vacateure would be in place.

So I listened to what April said again, giving her my personal cell phone number and wanting to work with her on a solution for the State of California, for the many people like Brianna and death and Jenna Mckay and all the other victims that came here and survivors that came here to testify of the brutality that they were involved in, including April Grayson. So please deliver that message to her.

She didn't give me her number, or I would reach out to her, but let her know that I heard her. And I took that violent section out so that Vakerture could apply again. 20 years ago when she was prosecuted, that was an injustice. But things have changed over the last 20 years.

As my colleague from Berkeley has said in closing, everybody who testified here today, I want you to know that we didn't get everything we wanted, but we are a spartan group to a large opposition, and we will never give up the fight. You've all done amazing work to get us where we are today. Hundreds of human trafficking survivors, advocates, police, social workers from all across California are rooting for our team today.

If this Bill gets passed at this Committee today, there will be a surge of hope for everyone who has gone through this horrific event. And thousands will be so grateful for the accomplishment. If we get it out of this Committee today, hopefully, the work that we've done will shine a bright light of hope. And here in Sacramento, in this building today for all the victims and human trafficking survivors that have been horrifically perpetrated by the crime of traffickers. And I respectfully ask for your vote.

Thank you, Senator Grove. If I'm just a point of privilege, I just want to state that I was with Senator Grove last year after we heard this Bill. And I have to say she has been one of the most committed Members that I've seen working in this space in trying to find both justice and grace when it comes to dealing with human trafficking.

And if anyone could see her heart in the way that she was moved last year with the failure of this Bill and how hard she's worked since then to make sure that she find that balance. I think it would bring reassurance to anyone who hesitates about this Bill. With that, Senator Grove, I am grateful for the work that you're doing and have done and will continue to do. And on that, I would be happy to support the Bill today. Madam Secretary, if you would please call the roll.

SB 14. The motion is do pass as amended, to appropriations. [Roll call].

We will put this bill on call for our absent members. Thank you very much. Senator Grove. I believe there is no clapping in the committee room. I sorry. We will now continue with Senator Umberg. Bill number three, SB 44. Welcome, Senator Umberg.

Thank you, Madam Chair. And members, a special thank you to.

Senator Umberg, Would you mind waiting just a minute while we have our audience leave the room?

Sure.

Okay. In the meantime, we could take the consent items. Thank you very much, Senator Skinner. Madam Secretary, if you would please call the roll.

[Roll Call]

Jordan and Mary Kennedy, for the time and attention they've devoted to this. A very, very special thank you to the family members who are back here in Sac, Sacramento, whose children have been lost to the fentanyl crisis.

They've taken their tragedy, their sorrow, their devastation, and turned it into something that they believe will prevent, and I believe will prevent others from suffering the same fate. We're back again. SB 44 is one of the many tools to deal with the fentanyl crisis. There's a fentanyl crisis in California.

Across the country. 2021 107,500 people died of overdose. In California, over 20,000 people died of overdose. Fentanyl is killing young people at a rate that is unprecedented. Fentanyl is different than other kinds of illegal drugs. I've worked in this space for many, many years.

I worked in the space in the Administration. I worked in the space in the army, in Afghanistan. I worked in this space in Latin America. And this is different. This is different than heroin. This is different than cocaine. This is even different than methamphetamine.

The difference is that when you overdose on heroin, you know you're ingesting heroin now, whether it's purer than you expected or whether it's in a greater volume or quantity than expected, which caused a death.

That's a tragedy. That's a tragedy. But fentanyl is different. Fentanyl, oftentimes comes without the person who ingests it knowing what they're ingesting. They think they're buying Xanax. They think they're buying oxycodone.

Even if they're buying it in the black market, they don't know that just a tiny bit of fentanyl can kill you. They don't know that as a consequence, they're dying. The Governor has declared somewhat of a State of emergency in San Francisco concerning this issue.

We presented this bill before. This new amended bill that was crafted with the assistance of District Attorney Brooke Jenkins is different. Here's what we've done. We have added a provision that says that. Let me back up a little bit.

This is crafted based on the Watson advisement. The Watson advisement is an advisement that's given to somebody who is convicted of driving under the influence. They're told, look it, you've driven under the influence. You now know that because you've been convicted.

Driving under the influence is very, very dangerous. If you do it again, you may kill somebody. So you're being warned that your punishment may well be increased if you drive drunk again.

There's no requirement, by the way, that you show in the first instance prior to getting the advisement, that somehow you knew you were driving drunk. But if you drive drunk again, we're just letting you know this punishment could be increased.

So what we've done here, in the amended version, in the amended version, we've said, look it, basically, the first time you sell fentanyl, you're told now, you've either pleaded guilty or you've been found guilty.

But there's been a recognition by virtue of a lab analysis or your own admission that you were distributing fentanyl the second time, if someone dies, if someone dies, then you have to know, or you should know, either actual or constructive knowledge that you were distributing something that had fentanyl.

So in order to even have an enhanced punishment the second time, you need to know or should know that you are selling or distributing fentanyl.

Now, I'm pleased to have you, Senator Ochoa Bogh, as the joint author on this measure, we've spent a lot of time, I appreciate the attention. As I mentioned, the committee staff, also Committee Members, we've spent a considerable amount of time addressing this tragedy. Let me be clear. This is one tool. This is one tool.

We are not going to arrest our way out of this crisis, but with prevention, with treatment, with education, as well as with prevention, in terms of preventing those who at one point had sold fentanyl from selling it again, we're going to make a dent in this crisis. It is but one of many tools that need to be employed in this all in all efforts approach to making sure that there are not more victims.

So with that, I have two witnesses here, Mayor Todd Gloria from San Diego, thank you again for being here. Madam Chair, if I might ask that Mayor Gloria be given the opportunity to testify.

Absolutely. With pleasure. Proceed us when you're ready.

Thank you. Madam Vice Chair, Members of the Committee, thank you, Senator Umberg, for the introduction, for authoring this bill. I stand before you all as mayor of the City of San Diego and the proud sponsor of this legislation. I'm here today to ask respectfully for your support. When we were here last month, I joined San Francisco District Attorney Brooke Jenkins.

We shared with you all the startling statistics walking through the fact that 6000 Californians die each year due to fentanyl overdose, that it's the number one killer of folks ages 18 to 45. It's the number one killer of homeless individuals in my county.

You heard all of the testimony from morning families when we were last here demanding action on this crisis. So I want to focus my comments today on the amendment that Senator Umberg just outlined.

At our last hearing, we spoke at length, I believe, about the concept of making sure that the drug dealer knowingly sells fentanyl in order for this advisor to apply. We have taken that amendment with hopes of earning this committee's support. Today, that admonishment has been updated to ensure that anyone who's convicted of a fentanyl charge be made aware that fentanyl is deadly.

And after being read that admonishment, if they choose to ignore it and go on to continue selling fentanyl and end up killing someone, at that point, this warning would kick in. This would be subject to the greater penalties. The entire goal here is to take the opportunity, when someone is caught dealing, to disrupt their behavior and to save lives. This drug, as you've heard me and the Senator say, is ravaging our cities.

That's why the League of California cities and big California cities as diverse as San Jose, San Francisco, Fresno, and Sacramento are all in support of Senate Bill 44. And we know that we are early in the legislative session. This bill is not in its final form.

But I think that when you take into account that we've already narrowed the scope of this bill significantly to apply only to fentanyl, limit its application to adults only, and limit the crime for when it will apply, I think what you've seen is a good faith effort to try and keep this bill moving forward. And that's what we're here today with this additional amendment as a showing of good faith in order to try and keep this bill going forward.

I ask that you all support the bill as it's being presented today so that we can take action on this crisis that is so urgent and in need of your help today. I ask for your support. Thank you, Senator.

Thank you. I believe Mr. Capelouto. Mr. Matt Capelouto. This bill has been denominated as Alexandra's law. That's Mr. And Mrs. Capelouto's daughter.

Good morning. As you can imagine, I'm frustrated to be here again. During my past visits, I've been hopeful and enthusiastic, broken and in tears and, yes, furious and emotional. I am positive that you all can sympathize on some level with the emotions that run through my heart and mind when talking about this issue.

I am a father whose daughter was killed by a drug dealer who traded her life for a few bucks. The evidence showed Alexandra was seeking Percocet.

The drug dealer later admitted to knowing the pills he sold her were counterfeit oxycodone pills made of fentanyl. My daughter did not make a wise choice in purchasing what she believed was a pharmaceutical grade medication illegally, and she paid the ultimate price.

However, what about the choice made by the person on the other side of that transaction? Do we accept his actions and let him continue to deceive people to death, as he did our Alex?

I see that terrible scenario as something that can be mitigated so other families don't have to hurt like my family does, because I believe, as humans, we are accountable to each other. We are responsible for protecting one another.

And as you know, our friends and families are being destroyed by the cell of illegal fentanyl in our communities. And I can't conceive a scenario where I wouldn't fight to protect them. While I am not a politician, what I am is not a politician.

I don't think like a politician, act like one, nor do I ever desire to become one. That's no disrespect to your service. That's just not who I am. And if there's one thing I've learned about our political system here in California is that it's fractured, split, skewed, in my opinion.

And that's where my frustration comes from. Alexandra's law is sensible. It's responsible. It moves the needle toward that, quote, unquote, doing something about it that we all want to believe our politicians are here for.

And three years later, I've yet to see it from this committee. And as you can imagine, that's frustrating. Call me naive but put yourself in my shoes. From where I'm standing, we have more support out there on the floor for this bill than we have from a group of five gatekeepers.

This committee is standing between doing nothing and creating some semblance of accountability for drug dealers who are knowingly risking the lives of Californians.

I've heard callbacks to the war on drugs and the failures of those policies, and it all sounds catchy and makes people feel guilty. I get it. But I have yet to hear a logical reason for refusing to give drug dealers a warning for selling counterfeit pills to people while knowing that person could die. The Watson advisement was established in the 1980s. Are we regretting that law? Are we calling it for it to be overturned? No, because it saves lives.

I look around this room and I look at people who have supported Alexandra's law. The politicians who want to do something, they have worked with your concerns and made adjustments to the bill to edge you all closer to allowing it to the floor.

Listening to perspectives, hearing our detractors bantering about this word or that phrase, finding any way to make this law something you can find in your heart to let all our representatives make a decision on.

And I am here begging you for you to keep this bill in existence. Keep the conversation alive. Keep a bill on the table that if adhered to, is preventative, not punitive. Give them a chance to do something as well. Please consider Alexandra's law for approval and let California's chosen representatives have the final say. Thank you.

Thank you very much, sir. We'll now move on to witnesses here in support of SB 44 in room 2200.

Cindy De Silva, deputy district attorney, on behalf of the California District Attorneys Association, in strong support.

Chair, members. Jonathan Feldman. On behalf of the California Police Chiefs Association, in support.

Pat Espinoza. On behalf of the San Diego County District Attorney's office, in support.

Izzy Swindler. Shaw Yoder Antwih. Schmelzer & Lange. My apologies. On behalf of the San Francisco Mayor London Breed, in support. Thank you.

Good morning, Madam Chair and senators. My name is Robert Gonzalez with crew strategies on behalf of the Orange County District Attorney's office, in support.

I'm standing here on behalf of all the brown and black moms that lost children in Senator Bradford's district, like my son Elijah, in full support.

I'm here representing parents against fentanyl in Sacramento County. On behalf of my beloved son Jeff, who is 17, that I lost to this crisis. I'm here in strong support of this bill. Thank you.

Hello, Committee Members. This is my late son Zach. And my name is Chris. And I represent victims of illicit drugs. We're from Placer County. I support this bill. How many others have to die before you act?

My name is Lisa Yizel, and I'm representing my son, Cameron. He's the victim of fentanyl poisoning on August 11, 2021. And I strongly support this bill.

My name is Merricka Cole, and I'm here in support of my son Merrick, who had autism and fentanyl still affected him. I support this bill. We don't want more people to die. The California people are watching this very closely. Thank you.

Megan Zimmer, representing Cameron March, forever 23. I support this bill.

Good morning, Madam Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. My name is Michael Furman. I'm the chief assistant district attorney from San Bernardino County, on behalf of District Attorney Jason Anderson. We support this bill. Thank you.

I'm Kay Shells. I'm here in memory of my son Nick. I support this bill. How many more have to die before this bill gets through?

Brandon Up. On behalf of the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department in support, thank you.

Todd Riebe, Amador County District Attorney, I urge you to support this bill.

Thank you very much. Do we have any other witnesses in support of SB 44 here in room 2200? Seeing none, we'll now move on to witnesses in opposite or lead opposition witnesses for SB 44.

Good morning. Good morning, Committee. Glenn Backes for the Ella Baker Center for Human Rights. I'll be brief. Committee is very familiar with the bill. The three strongest predictors of being convicted for possession, for sale, or sale is being poor, is having a substance abuse disorder or being a person of color, black, Latino or indigenous.

We've previously heard testimony in this committee from a mother who lost her kid because his friends, when he was overdosing, was afraid to call 911 or take his friend to the ER.

They were afraid of jail or prison. I've heard this story many times because I've chosen to work with families who've suffered the worst losses possible. They are organized as the group broken no more. They advocate for more treatment, more harm reduction, compassion and intelligence. On behalf of broken no more and Ella Baker, Center for Human Rights, we urge no vote.

Good morning, Chair and Committee Members. My name is Jeannette Zanipatin and I'm the California state director for Drug Policy Alliance. We are also here in respectful opposition, as the bill has just been recently amended. Our hearts go out to everyone who has been touched by this overdose crisis.

We have all have had members, family members, who have been touched by this public health crisis that we're in. We are a national organization promoting drug policies grounded in science, compassion, health and human rights.

While we clearly understand the need to address the overdose crisis and assume the best intentions by the author, DPA knows that further criminalization will exacerbate the overdose crisis instead of reducing the availability of this deadly drug, and will further serve to introduce more dangerous drugs into our drug supply.

We are also concerned that one of the main questions we have for this bill still remains unanswered in the case of individuals not convicted of sales or transportation offenses, such as those found in health and safety code sections 1135111352 and 11379.6. Will the law require a court finding that the person exchanged a controlled substance containing fentanyl for value? If so, under what standard of proof would this be?

This is not only an unsupported practice, but it runs counter to the way our justice system operates for criminal proceedings I could sit here and tell you how further criminalization, further stigmatize folks that are substance users. There's also just a really fine line between some folks who are drug sellers and drug users or subsistence sellers, and those folks are also in need of treatment, need of harm reduction, and need of other social supports and services.

And so we really want to urge you to look at the science, look at the evidence, and know what we know today is that further criminalization will not help and solve this problem. We need a multipronged approach that really looks at the State of California, providing investments, providing things like treatment on demand, ensuring that we implement overdose prevention centers, and support harm reduction services.

We also need to provide social supports in our educational system so that we can have students that do not go into, that are able to support their families as well. And we also need drug education that is grounded in science and evidence, and that is reality based for both our parents and our youth. I am also a mother of two daughters, and I have these conversations all day long with my kids. It is a real crisis that's touching a lot of individuals.

But we know that there are ways for the state to address this overdose crisis in a comprehensive manner. And as the senator himself said, we're not in a position to continue to incarcerate our way out of this. We need to find solutions that are multipronged. Thank you.

Thank you very much. We'll now continue with witnesses in opposition to SB 44 here in room 2200.

Lesli Caldwell-Houston. For the California Public Defenders Association and the San Francisco Public Defender's office, in opposition.

Jim Lindbergh, on behalf of the Friends Committee on Legislation of California, in respectful opposition.

Thank you. Do we have any other witnesses in opposition to SB 44 here in room 2200? Seeing none, we'll now continue to witnesses via the teleconference service, both in support and opposition. And just as a reminder to our witnesses waiting to testify via the teleconference services at this time, we'll take your name, the organization you are representing, and your position on the bill, whether it's support or opposition.

Mr. Moderator, if you would please queue up the witnesses, both in support and opposition to SB 44, and we will begin.

Thank you, Madam Chair. As she indicated, if you are in support or opposition to SB 44, please take this opportunity and press one, followed by zero. And we will begin with line 268, please go ahead. You're open. 268, you're in. Line 268?

Yes.

We will go to line 270.

My name is Maria Ortega with Adrian Forever Foundation. I represent a victim of fentanyl poisoning. And I strongly support this bill. Honorable Senators, how many have to die before you ask? Thank you.

Line 25, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is David. My son was killed by fentanyl poisoning. I strongly support this bill. How many more have to die before you? Respectfully, from Connecticut.

Madam Chair, I just want to let you know we're having a weird sound issue right now with kind of an echo, but we'll try move on. We'll go to line 295. Line 295, you are open.

Hello? Yes.

Please proceed, ma'am. Yes, we can hear you.

Okay. My name is Kimberly, and I represent a victim of fentanyl prison. I support this bill, and respectfully, I want to ask you guys how many have.

Thank you very much. Just as a reminder, name, position, and the organization that you're representing at this time.

Thank you. Line 299, you are open. 299, you just took yourself out of queue. Okay, go ahead.

Okay. My name is Steve Stewart, representative victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I am in support of this bill.

Thank you. One moment, Madam Chair. Okay, next, we'll go to line 43. Please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Wanda DeCordo, and I represent Christian Stephen Knight, a victim of fentanyl poisoning and also drug induced homicide. Lost Voices of Fentanyl, and I am in strong support of SB 44. How many more have to die before us?

Line 298, please go ahead.

My name is Edo Ortega from Temecula, California. I represent Zachary Sterrett, a victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I am in strong support of this bill.

Line 151, you are open.

My name is Michelle Bowman. I lost my only child, Joshua Bowman. I am support of SB 44.

Line 301, you are open.

My name is Joanna, and I represent a victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I strongly support this bill. Thank you.

127, please go ahead.

My name is Brianna, and I'm a recovering addict. And I represent Joshua Bowman of fentanyl poisoning. I support this bill.

Line 23, please go ahead.

This is Lilia Dardone. As a mom of two sons that have previously fought drug addiction, I am in support of this bill.

Line 102, please go ahead.

My name is Angela Knight Hunt, and I represent my nephew, as well as three of my children who have suffered from addiction. My nephew was a victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I strongly support SB 44. How many more need to die before we act?

Line 105, please go ahead.

My name is Denise Hornback. I'm calling in remembrance of my son, Jimmy Hornbeck, who was poisoned, not overdosed, in 2021, and I strongly support Alexandra's law. SB 44.

107, your line is open.

Hi, my name is Terry Almanza. I am the founder of Drug Induced Homicide foundation, the mother of the late Sydney Sherrigan, a 28 year veteran of the Chicago Police Department, and I strongly support SB 44, Alexandra's law. God bless.

Line 111, please go ahead.

Griffin Shamash, President of Drug Awareness Foundation and mother of Tyler, who is dead from fentanyl. I strongly support.

132. Please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Lisa Jimenez from Temecula, California. I strongly support this bill in honor of my son Jake, who was poisoned by fentanyl.

147, your line is open. 147. Are you muted?

Hello?

Go ahead.

Hi. My name is Margie. Hello?

Can you please go ahead?

Yes, we can hear you. Please say your name.

My name is Margie Garcia and I am in strong support of SC 44.

Thank you, ma'am.

148, you are open.

Good morning. My name is Eric Kittendorf. I represent my daughter Alyssa, who was only 17 years old when she was poisoned with fentanyl. I strongly support this bill.

Please, go ahead. 168.

Sarah Rigney, on behalf of Initiate Justice and respectful opposition.

186, you are open.

Yes, hi, my name is Stephanie Sula, and I support this bill in saving potentially hundreds of thousands of lives here in California.

Line 209, please go ahead. Line 209. Go ahead, 209. One more shot. 209, would you like to testify? We'll go to line 213.

Hi, my name is Kathy Miranda. I represent Garrett Miranda from Alameda County, who was poisoned by fentanyl. I strongly support SB 44.

You are open. Line 218.

Hi, Ray Grangoff, on behalf of Orange County Sheriff's Department, in support of Alexander's law.

22, please go ahead. 22, you are open.

Can you hear me?

Yes, ma'am.

Okay. My name is Kieran Drum and I represent and honor my nephew, Jack William Mccarthy, age 19, a victim who is killed from fentanyl poisoning. I strongly support SB 44. How many more need to die?

Line 222, you are open.

Yes, my name is Carol Bullman. I'm representing my nephew, Joshua Bullman, who was murdered by fentanyl. I strongly support SB 44.

Line 231, you are open.

Hello, my name is Shannon Heil. I'm with Placer County Moms for Liberty, and we strongly support this bill. The opposition just wants more money. Thank you.

Go aheadline. 244.

Hi, my name is Cheryl Gale. I'm director at Chapel of Orange in Orange County, California. I am strong support of SB 44. How many memorials do I have to do for fentanyl deaths before this bill hits the floor and is passed? Thank you.

Line 248, please go ahead.

Hi, I'm Robert Ezell. I live in Garden Valley, El Dorado County, and I'm calling in today in support of SB 44 for my son, Cameron, who died on August 11, 2021.

264, please go ahead. Can you hear us? 264.

Hello? Yes, Julia, former drug user and now parent. I strongly support SB 44.

Line 273, please go ahead. Line 273, you are open.

Yeah, this is Matt Sarah. I'm calling on behalf of my late brother, Zach Sarah, who's killed by counterfeit pill, and I fully support this bill.

Line 33, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Kim Erling. I represent my only child, Samantha Kyle, forever 22 and seven months pregnant with my only grandchild. I am in support of SB 44.

You are open. Line 44.

Hi, my name is Kathy McCarthy in honor of my late son, Jack McCarthy, age 19, due to fentanyl poisoning. I support SB 44. How many more need to die?

Line 56, please go ahead.

Hello.

You're open.

Can you hear me?

Yes.

My name is Thomas J. Wood Senior, brief parent of Lisa Marie Wood Weigel, my daughter, and Amanda Jean Bonier, my granddaughter, in support of SB 44 from Chicago, Illinois.

Line 59, you are open. Are you muted? Line 59. Line 59, we'll move along to line 67. Please go ahead.

Amber Salazar, in honor of Dresden Alizaldi, poisoned by fentanyl. In strong support of the bill. How many more have to die before you act?

79, you are open.

This is Michelle Leopold, bereaved mother of my forever 18 year old son, Trevor, who was poisoned by fentanyl three and a half years ago. And I strongly support this needed prong of the multipronged approach to the never seen epidemic of fentanyl. Thank you.

Line 86, you are open.

This is Orlene Kerla. I represent the organization of Eagle Forum of California. We strongly support this bill, SB 44, thank you.

Line 90, you are open. Line 90, please go ahead. Hello, you're open.

This is Susan Sousa. I'm calling in memory of my daughter, Melanie Meehan, who was poisoned by fentanyl. Please support SB 44.

And we will go to line 209, you are open. Line 209, did you mute yourself? One more shot. Line 209, we'll move on to 243. Please go ahead.

Yes, thank you. My name is Desiree Tellup. I'm an attorney from Orange County and represent my brother, Dominic DeRosa, who is 28 and passed in October 2023. October 2020. The pain is far too great once you have lost a loved one or family member, as so many of us have, and I'm pleading with the senate to approve this bill.

Line 276, please go ahead.

My name is Mona Leonardi from Napa County. I represent my son, Michael, who was poisoned by fentanyl at the age of 20 years old by a fake prescription pill that was a lethal dose of fentanyl. I strongly support this bill.

278, please go ahead.

Good morning, Chair and members, Elisa Arcidiacono with the League of California Cities in strong support. Thank you.

Please go ahead. Line 279. 279.

Good morning. My name is Nedridge Inkins and I represent my son, Justin, a victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I highly support SB 44. How many more have to die before we act? I strongly urge you to support SB 44.

You are open line 280.

My name is Michael Sleeve. I'm a California voter and I strongly support Alexandria's law. And if this isn't passed, you put all of us parents that aren't victims yet at risk. Thank you.

Line 285, please go ahead.

My name is Kathy Lancaster and I represent my family member, Nick Scholes, who was a victim of fentanyl poisoning. I strongly support SB 44. Senators Wiener, Bradford and Wahab, how many. Have to die before you act? Thank you.

Line 290. You are open

Students for Sensible Drug laws in support.

Line 292.

Hi, my name is Sue Brown and I represent my grandson, Garrett Miranda, who was a victim of fentanyl poisoning. I strongly support SB 44. Thank you.

Line 294, please go ahead.

Hi, my name is Edith Gonzalez, in honor of Adrian De Jesus, a victim of fentanyl poisoning, and I strongly support this bill. Don't let more die. Please act. Thank you.

296, your line is open.

Hi, my name is Bertha Delanda. I'm a parent and a chemist, and I represent a victim of fentanyl poisoning. I am in strong support of SB 44.

Line 309, please go ahead. You're open. 309. We can hear you. That's you.

My name is Aldo Mendoza, representing Project Eli. I strongly support SB 44, and we need to help these killers accountable. Thank you.

Mr. Moderator. Mr. Moderator, if you would. We're going to actually take a pause so that we could give one of our members an opportunity to speak, as he's going to have to leave to present another bill I believe is the case. But we want to make sure that he has an opportunity to speak and share his comments at this time. So if you would please just pause the teleconference witnesses, and we will pass the microphone over to Senator Wiener.

Thank you, madam.

We'll do. Thank you.

Thank you, Madam Vice Chair. And yes, the Governmental Organization Committee is about to shut down. And so I need to go over and present my bill over there. But I did want to stay for this entire bill, because fentanyl is an incredibly important issue. And I just want to say.

This committee was extremely clear last time when there was only one out of five members voted for it. I was clear. And I think my colleagues, I think, were in alignment with me, that we were willing to pass this bill out of committee. And I think that remains true for me, and I imagine it probably remains true for my colleagues with an amendment that in order to trigger this very serious and very legally consequential warning, and it's not just a warning.

It's not just a judge providing a stern lecture to someone. This is something that literally gets recorded on the abstract of conviction and is there with you, I think, forever. But in order for that legally consequential, serious step to happen, that you should at least have known or should have known that there was fentanyl in what you were selling, not even requiring only actual knowledge known or should have known that is not in this bill. I want to be very, very clear.

There was an amendment made. It did not address the issue that I raised or that this committee raised in the last hearing. And I just want to make sure we have clarity about that. And I respect the author and I respect their difference of opinion on this, but it does not address the issue that we raised. There's been a lot of comparison to DUIs and the Watson admonition.

When you are drunk driving, to get convicted of drunk driving, you know that you drank alcohol, you know that you got into a car. It is all with knowledge or intentional. And, in fact, I'm not a DUI expert, but my understanding is that if you did not know that you were drinking alcohol, if someone slipped you alcohol and you did not realize it, that is actually a defense to a DUI charge.

And so comparing this without that knowledge or should have known requirement, comparing that to the DUI context is not a good comparison, because when you are drunk driving, you know that you drank alcohol, you know you got into a car.

This committee, I think, works hard to try to find resolutions. This is my 7th year on the committee, and we frequently, there are bills that come to us that we have issues with. You saw one just before this.

We in the past have not supported Senator Grove's bill. Senator Grove worked with us. We took an amendment, and we supported it. There's another bill coming up from Senator Alvarado-Gil, but I would not support it in the original forum we've worked out, I believe, a resolution on that.

And so we try to work with authors to come up with resolutions and move good policy. And again, I'm not criticizing the author. The author strongly believes in what he's doing. But we have a disagreement here.

This bill has come to us multiple times. On the first few versions of it. It applied to all drugs, not just fentanyl. It was sold as a fentanyl bill and applied to all drugs. The original introduced version of this bill applied to all drugs. The author did amend it to clarify that it was fentanyl. But to be clear, this bill, a conviction, will trigger this warning for any drug conviction, if there was fentanyl in it.

I represent a city that, like many cities in this country, is being deeply impacted by fentanyl. And for those of us who work very, very hard to try to expand access to treatment, to try to enact measures to help people not die from overdoses, for those of us who work very, very hard to do that, I respectfully disagree with the repeated claims we've heard today that this is a, quote, unquote, do nothing.

Some of us work very, very hard to try to keep people healthy and to try to keep people from dying, which is job number one. And to my constituents in San Francisco, and I deeply respect my district attorney and my mayor, and I have expressed to both of them what this bill would need to be for me to support it so that it would be the right policy in San Francisco. There's enormous frustration around the open air drug dealing, particularly in the tenderloin.

In other neighborhoods, too, particularly in the tenderloin. And I have been very clear that we need to disrupt and end that open air drug market. That is a public safety, huge problem for the people of the tenderloin, for residents, for people who work there, people who own businesses there. No one should have to deal with that. No one should have to have their kid going to school, walking past drug dealers on the street.

And I am a supporter of disrupting and ending that open air drug market. But this bill is not just about the tenderloin. We are making policy for the 40 million people of the State of California, from the ocean to Nevada, from Oregon to the Mexico border.

And the idea that some college student selling a pill to his roommate and having no idea and no reason to know that there's fentanyl in there would then get this nuclear murder warning on his or her record, I think that's a step too far. And I think people should at least have to have had some indication that what they were selling had fentanyl in it for this to apply.

So, Madam Chair, thank you for allowing me to make these statements so that I can present my bill before the Committee closes down. But I wanted to express why I will continue to not be supporting this bill today.

Senator Wiener, would you mind if Senator Umberg had an opportunity to respond?

Absolutely.

I know. Senator Wiener, I know you've got to go to another committee, as do I. Let me just respond to the first part of your comments concerning the Watson advisement. This advisement actually applies even more narrowly than the Watson advisement.

As you mentioned, for the Watson advisement to apply, you need to be convicted of drunk driving or driving under the influence. So you needed to know you were imbibing an alcohol or some other substance that would interfere with your driving and then you needed to drive.

Those two things are required. The predicate to this bill is, one, you need to know you are distributing, selling something that is illegal. So you know you're selling something that is illegal. Number one. Number two, you're then told, because you've seen either the testimony, you're pleaded guilty, you've been convicted of selling fentanyl. So you've been convicted, you've sold fentanyl one time. You know it.

Now query whether this happens to be the first time you sold fentanyl or not, but let's assume it is the first time in your life you've sold, distributed something with fentanyl in it. You get no increased punishment, nothing. You get your probation term, you get no increased punishment.

But if you, now that you know that you've sold fentanyl and you sell fentanyl again and you know, or you should know because all the circumstances would lead a reasonable person to believe you're selling fentanyl. This is the second time, and you kill somebody, and you kill somebody.

Then at that point in time it's appropriate that we say, hey, listen, the law is going to provide after you're on notice that you sold fentanyl and by the way, you didn't stop, by the way, you didn't seek treatment, by the way, you didn't do anything to change your course of conduct and you killed somebody, then yes, you should get a greater punishment.

You should be prevented from selling fentanyl a third time. That's my view. And I understand that. I appreciate your point of view, but we do have a strong opinion.

And I appreciate that. But just to be crystal clear, when you get convicted of, and I say this only because there's been a lot of comparisons to the Watson warning. When you get convicted of a DUI and get that warning, you know, before you step into that car that you drank alcohol, you know that you're turning on the ignition of a car. You know those things. This bill is about fentanyl. Everything about this discussion is about fentanyl because I agree fentanyl is toxic.

This bill isn't about whether you intended to sell meth or intended to sell cocaine. This is about fentanyl. And this bill does not require, in terms of your sale that triggers the warning, does not require you to have even the slightest indication that there was fentanyl in there. And I think, I respect where you're coming from.

I think this is going to have, if it passes, a lot of unintended consequences and sweep in, a lot of people that a lot of people would be surprised, would be swept in. I just want to be really clear about that.

The same as when you're drunk. You know, one, you've had something to drink, and two, you're driving, but you don't know you're above the limit. And the prosecution doesn't have to prove, by the way, I know I've had 24 beers, so therefore I am drunk. All the prosecution need be proven. All we would want the prosecution to prove is that you've had too much to drink. You knew you were drinking.

By the way that advisement comes, even if, for whatever reason you say, I didn't know I was ingesting alcohol. If you're convicted, then you get the advisement. The same thing here. If you know you are selling something illegal and you must know that and it contains fentanyl, you get the advisement.

Yeah, I understand that. And one last thing I just want to point out, this bill also is not even limited to selling. It's transporting, it's importing. So if you are someone who is transporting, even if you didn't actually sell the drug, this is a very broad bill. We all agree this is a big problem. I don't think this is the solution. It's going to have unintended consequences. So thank you.

Thank you. The public is not allowed to speak at this time, and I apologize for that. So we have to maintain a little level of decorum here for everybody to have an opportunity to respectfully share their comments and thoughts. So we will now, did you have anything else to say at this moment to Senator?